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jeffburch
04-28-2006, 04:10 PM
4 races or 3 ????

jb

CMC17
04-28-2006, 04:26 PM
I'm game either way. The heat isn't an issue for me.

You guys decide. :D

I like getting out of the track early on Sunday.

Double points 40min R4?

y5e06
04-28-2006, 04:44 PM
I personally much rather prefer four races during a weekend, regardless of their length.
One solution that has been brought up and, I believe, is used in other regions is to:
Substitue Sunday's qualifying with an R3 (20min), then have R4 as 40 minutes.
Not sure how it would be decided for starting spots for R3 or R4.
Maybe R3 finish order is 40min R4 grid order ala qualify race for nationals.
R3 start could be based off of season points, inverted season points, drawing randomly from a hat (that would be fun), youngest to oldest, car numbers, inverted car numbers, heaviest to lightest (car & driver weight!!!), etc
Or R4 start order could just be like qual and based off of fastest lap within the R3 session. That would play to some interesting strategies.
R4 would count as the qualifier race used for contingency points etc.

GlennCMC70
04-28-2006, 04:48 PM
the only thing i want is if we run a long race on Sun, count the points for the race two times. we all planned for 4 races a weekend before the season started. no reason to not score them that way. we race 2 races in 1, why not get the points for 2? just record the points in 2 colums.
other than that, i know now to not save the car for a 40 minute race. i'll be running all out next time! :wink:

jeffburch
04-28-2006, 04:54 PM
the only thing i want is if we run a long race on Sun, count the points for the race two times. we all planned for 4 races a weekend before the season started. no reason to not score them that way. we race 2 races in 1, why not get the points for 2? just record the points in 2 colums.
other than that, i know now to not save the car for a 40 minute race. i'll be running all out next time! :wink:

I dunno about that. Cut a tire and you hose yourself, twice.

jb

michaelmosty
04-28-2006, 05:34 PM
I personally much rather prefer four races during a weekend, regardless of their length.
One solution that has been brought up and, I believe, is used in other regions is to:
Substitue Sunday's qualifying with an R3 (20min), then have R4 as 40 minutes.
Not sure how it would be decided for starting spots for R3 or R4.
Maybe R3 finish order is 40min R4 grid order ala qualify race for nationals.
R3 start could be based off of season points, inverted season points, drawing randomly from a hat (that would be fun), youngest to oldest, car numbers, inverted car numbers, heaviest to lightest (car & driver weight!!!), etc
Or R4 start order could just be like qual and based off of fastest lap within the R3 session. That would play to some interesting strategies.
R4 would count as the qualifier race used for contingency points etc.
Just my opinion but this idea would be awesome! Have 4-races, regular points for each race including a 40 min. R4.
I would be game for Morgan's suggestion of some sort of random grid for R3 and R4.
I'm all for the max. # of races and max amount of racing time!! :twisted: :twisted:

GlennCMC70
04-28-2006, 05:43 PM
problem w/ the random grid is Toyo Bucks and other Contigency programs are paid off of races that we quall for.
i still think giving up saturdays practice and moving that time to sunday for a long race would be the best for those times we run a long race.

macstang
04-28-2006, 05:43 PM
I'm with Michael and Morgan.

I'm also with Eric on getting done early on sunday. It sure makes a long drive better when I don't get home at 3 AM.

jeffburch
04-28-2006, 06:54 PM
problem w/ the random grid is Toyo Bucks and other Contigency programs are paid off of races that we quall for.
i still think giving up saturdays practice and moving that time to sunday for a long race would be the best for those times we run a long race.

I dont see how time from Sat moved to Sun helps NASA.
Remember before daylite savings time and the short days, there wasn't enough daylite. If you give up time Sat it has to be spent Sat.
I'm all about the most track time.
Also, NASATx "isn't gonna be told what to do by the racers."

jb

GlennCMC70
04-28-2006, 07:07 PM
some groups get more track time saturday than sunday and vise versa. so all we do is switch to being a part of the group who gets more track time sunday.
or we could do the long race satuday.

jeffburch
04-28-2006, 08:24 PM
or we could do the long race satuday.

That's an idear.

jb

David Love AI27
04-28-2006, 09:05 PM
1st session on Sat: Qual 1 for R1
2nd " : R1 Grid based on Qual eligible for contingency $
3rd " : R2 Grid inverted based on morning qual
4th " : Qual 2 for R3 on sunday morning
5th session Sunday: R3 Grid based on Qual 2, eligible for contingency $
6th " : R4 40 min. standing/invert. based Qual 2

6 sessions, 2 quals, 2 contingency $ races, 2 chalange races

Going home early, priceless

David Love AI27
04-28-2006, 09:11 PM
or we could do the long race satuday.

That's an idear.

jb

there is more wear on car and driver and some may want to opt out, plus you Dallas guys will enjoy getting out of Houston early if we just do the two on Sunday. believe me it makes a difference getting away by 3:00. not that I would know since we hung around awhile last weekend.

marshall_mosty
04-28-2006, 09:29 PM
I like the idea... if my fuel system works.

I'd go for something like this.

Saturday
#1 15 minute practice
#2 15 minute qual
#3 20 minute race (R1) (rolling start) (contingency), based on qual times
#4 20 minute race (R2) (standing start), inverted grid based on finishing order, from R1

Sunday
#5 20 minute race (R3) (standing start)(contingency), regular grid based on finishing order
#6 40 minute race (R4) (standing start), grid based on numbers in a hat... hey it's long enough for the fast guys to get ahead... (count it single points since it's the second race of the day) gives people an option to drop if they have mechanical trouble, or get a bad grid position. Remember, if we do a random grid, we all have the same odds of pulling a pole postion, or dead last...

We would still have our normal amount of track time, just the Sunday #5 is a race instead of qualification. Group two races into one. We are really saving NASA some time in the deal too.

David Love AI27
04-28-2006, 09:35 PM
We would still have our normal amount of track time, just the Sunday #5 is a race instead of qualification. Group two races into one. We are really saving NASA some time in the deal too.

But some are qustioning the contingency money and the need for two races with qualifiers...

practice? don need no stinkin practice... :twisted:

jeffburch
04-28-2006, 09:58 PM
I like the idea... if my fuel system works.


There'll be a linchin if it doesn't.
Pressure on. Get it right.

jb

Mike Bell
04-29-2006, 09:17 AM
I got to get that cool suit installed.................. 8)

marshall_mosty
04-29-2006, 01:22 PM
Jeff,
Believe me.... I'm going to get it right. I've had three consecutive weekends where I missed races due to that pile of crap...

I am going to hard wire it to the relay that controlls my transponder. If the transponder is working, the car will be running. I'll take the break from Hallett to MSR-H to completely revamp all the wiring in ernest.

chicane23
04-29-2006, 04:56 PM
Marshall, I have to give you a hard time now. I can't resist.

Looks like the home wiring job is taking it's toll on you.

I remember all the hype and mixed word you and I talked a few months back about pulling wires and cutting on the stock harness would save much more money then a Painless wiring harness. ;-)

Are you having fun and do you still fill that way? ;-)

marshall_mosty
04-29-2006, 10:00 PM
Ok John, I deserved that... :)
Maybe I'll step up the the "painless" harness in the offseason.

Sometimes it's just hard lessons learned. Money is the driving factor for most of us, so for me, the stock wiring was what I had to deal with. Thankfully I don't have anyone, or anything to impress with my race results... except my ego of course.

See you guys at MSR-H!!

chicane23
04-30-2006, 09:10 AM
BTW, sorry to hear about the troubles and I hope you get them worked out soon. ;-)

marshall_mosty
04-30-2006, 09:24 AM
John,
You and me both... I'll have it hammered out by MSR-H for sure. Even if it takes a dedicated circuit solely for the pump.

Now, learning how to drive a car with a T/A... that may take a little bit of time.

chicane23
04-30-2006, 10:37 AM
Glad to hear you will make MSR-H.

Should make the car stop and accel. better.

What suspension items do you have in the rear now?

chicane23
04-30-2006, 10:40 AM
Mike B. you really should get a Cool Suite. It will change everything about your driving.

You will not have to swipe the sweat from your forehead as much and fatigue will not set in so soon. ;-)

marshall_mosty
04-30-2006, 10:28 PM
John,

The rear setup is:
Griggs "Street" Panhard Bar
Griggs "Severe Duty" Torque Arm
H&R T/A springs for 500 lb/in front coil overs
Koni SA's
MM lower control arms (standard with sway bar mount)
Stock GT sway bar

Front setup is:
Stock K-Member
Stock SN-95 Arms
96+ Spindles
Koni DA's
Bump Steer Kit
4 cyl sway bar

I'm planning on going to MSR-C in a couple of weeks to shake the car down on a track that I know what the lap times and "feel" should be. I really don't want to learn how to drive the car on a new track... or at least pretty new to me.

If you have any ideas on baseline setup, I'm all ears.

AI#97
05-01-2006, 09:41 AM
Marshall, I do seriously recommend putting some sort of "guide" in the rear spring perch to make things easier as those springs will tend to fall out when you jack the car up. Might be different on the fox chassis? I would also start thinking about a a shock with a bunch of rebound dampening....the TA setup will start to induce rear wheel hop if the rear rises or the front dives too much. the race valved bilsteins in the rear for me fixed that.

Only other "setup" items I can suggest is get ready for a lot of understeer. with the stock front and MM TA/PH, my car pushed badly... but with some new power, you might be able to steer it with the gas more?! :P

marshall_mosty
05-01-2006, 09:53 AM
Marshall, I do seriously recommend putting some sort of "guide" in the rear spring perch to make things easier as those springs will tend to fall out when you jack the car up. :P

Matt, I have already installed some ghetto PVC guides from left over pipe that I used to build my tire rack in the garage. No floppy springs for me!!


Only other "setup" items I can suggest is get ready for a lot of understeer. with the stock front and MM TA/PH, my car pushed badly... but with some new power, you might be able to steer it with the gas more?!

I'm putting the rear sway bar back on and will probably loosen the end links on the front to allow it to roll more to keep it balanced.