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Todd Covini
03-24-2009, 09:37 PM
19.3.6 Double Yellow Flags
Description: Two (2) solid motionless yellow flags, displayed at every manned flag
station around the course.
Uses: NO PASSING is permitted. This is used to indicate “a full course yellow.” This
means that there might be a problem somewhere on the track. Drivers are NOT
required to significantly slow their vehicles, however they should be prepared to
encounter a “local Yellow Flag” situation and/or a Pace Car (or a very slow moving pack
behind the Pace Car). The displaying of Double Yellow Flags does not guarantee the
appearance of a Pace Car. It is a command that NO PASSING IS ALLOWED until the
Pace Car has pulled off the course (if applicable) and the driver has passed next
manned flag station that is not displaying any Yellow Flag(s).

Waco Racer
03-25-2009, 08:56 AM
CCR 2.12 & 21.1 means that Drivers are required to slow their vehicle to pace speeds during a Double Yellow Flag course condition whether a Pace/Safety car is dispatched or not. The lead car is required to maintain that speed until shown a green flag at the Start/Finish line 20.12.1 & 20.13.

(MODERATOR EDIT FOR CLARITY)

2.12 Officials / Rules Hierarchy
This section is intended to clarify hierarchy among some officials and rules. Where there
is a conflict, the following order should be used. Each item on this list supersedes the
prior listed item whenever there is a conflict:
• Club Codes and Regulations
• Class Rules
• Local or Event Supplemental Rules
• Drivers’ Meeting Information
• Orders From Officials
• Race Director
• Executive Director
• Medical Staff (with regards to patient care and their duties).

21.1 Adjustments By The Race Director
The Race Director reserves the right to make changes in rules and/or penalties to
ensure fairness of all aspects of competition. He/she will make every effort to correct
problem situations to the fairness of the majority before invoking penalties, in full or in
part.

20.12.1 Pace Car Restart – General
Note: This section indicates the normal procedures for restarting a race however CCR
Section #20.13 does apply.
The Pace Car driver will take direction from Race Control or the Race Director. When
the Pace Car is used to restart a race, the Pace Car driver will slow the field and allow
the drivers time to realign themselves in preparation for the restart. The Pace Car driver
should turn out the Pace Car lights approximately two (2) turns before the Start/Finish
line to indicate a restart. The lead car will be responsible for pacing the field slowly, and
at a steady pace, until the green flag is shown. [Note: Pace means “steady speed.”
Acceleration (or deceleration) after the pace car leaves the track, but before the green
flag is displayed, is illegal.]
If the lead car does not pace the field slowly enough, or the field has improper alignment,
the Starter will display no flag or a yellow flag, thus indicating one (1) more pace lap. At
this point, it is up to the lead car to pace the rest of the field at half-race speed until the
final two (2) turns. The final two (2) turns, and the approach to the Starter, will be done
slowly enough, and at a steady pace, to allow all cars to come into proper alignment. If
the leader does not maintain a proper pace that results in two (2) aborted starts or
restarts in a row, the green flag will be displayed, and the leader will be issued a penalty
by the Race Director, after the race. The penalty shall be no more severe than
disqualification, and may be as little as a warning, however the typical penalty is loss of
three (3) positions. Alternatively a warning with a $250 fine (fine suspended for six (6)
months) is considered another acceptable penalty for a Rookie or drivers relatively new
to NASA.

20.13 Restarts and Resumptions
Restarts and Resumptions occur when conditions change from a Full Course Yellow
and/or a Pace Car situation, or a Red Flag had previously been shown. A Restart is a
formal way of resuming a session described below. A Resumption is an informal
continuation. Generally, a Resumption is used to continue a session other than a race,
and a Restart is used to continue a race. Competitors should understand that a race
session might Restart or Resume without notice. Restarts are single file, unless
otherwise stated by the series rules, directors, etc.

evarner
03-25-2009, 09:19 AM
I'm confused and this really needs to be crystal clear before we go out on-track again.

GlennCMC70
03-25-2009, 09:29 AM
well the rule says we do not need to significantly slow our vehicles. we still need to slow down, just not significantly.

evarner
03-25-2009, 09:43 AM
Pace speed is definitely significant over race speed. When the pace car came out, we were runing at 3/10ths as opposed to the 9/10ths everyone was traveling during the double yellow.

The problem as I see it is if Racer X2 in second place decides to slow down to pace speed while having Racer X3 behind him who wants nothing other than to catch Racer X1, but is unable to pass and sees Racer X1 pulling out 40-50 car lengths ahead. This could potentially cause a situation where Racer X1 is 3/4 a lap ahead when the green flag drops.

Thus, we all need to be on the same page and know how fast "pace" speed is as opposed to "race" speed.

I didn't feel comfortable traveling at 9/10ths during the double yellow, but had I not kept up with the car in front of me - the above scenario had potential.

.02

GlennCMC70
03-25-2009, 09:56 AM
when the pace car came out, it was way too slow. i was woried my car was going to overheat.

Rob Liebbe
03-25-2009, 09:56 AM
[ It is a command that NO PASSING IS ALLOWED until the
Pace Car has pulled off the course (if applicable) and the driver has passed next
manned flag station that is not displaying any Yellow Flag(s).

I guess we all violated this rule on the back to green in Race 4. We all took off after passing the last flag displaying yellow, not waiting until passing the first corner station not displaying a flag.

This needs to be cleared up and I never did understand why NASA rules differed from SCCA and others.

ShadowBolt
03-25-2009, 10:00 AM
I didn't feel comfortable traveling at 9/10ths during the double yellow, but had I not kept up with the car in front of me - the above scenario had potential.


My thoughts exactly.


JJ

mitchntx
03-25-2009, 11:02 AM
when the pace car came out, it was way too slow. i was woried my car was going to overheat.

In my best ViniDrumDez voice ... "No one says you have to remove the fans. If you do, it's the risk you run."

That's no different than me going out with minimal fuel and fuel starving the last 5 laps of R3. Could I have called a time out to go get more fuel?

I made the decision, I rolled the dice ... I paid the price.

The words "pace car speed"and "significantly" are too ambiguous and too subjective. No one that I know has a working speedometer. So it's absolutely unmeasrueable.

Jerry's and Eric's comfort zone was "significantly" lower than mine or James' or Al's.

Yes, I heard Clifton say that track rules require a DY when an extraction is in progress. And MSRC is the only track that has that administrative rule and it's probably driven by insurance.

rpoz27
03-25-2009, 11:07 AM
Control had me slow y'all to 25mph before Big Bend, in an attempt to get Jeremy clear before we passed hot pits so that I could duck in and y'all could have a green flag, asap. He didn't get clear until just before we got to the new course and control told me to leave the track there, instead of going all the way around. It was close and you guys were lucky. At any other track, y'all would have been stuck behind my helmetless, street car driving butt for another lap.

Anyone who was afraid they might overheat while behind a pace car in March should maybe think ahead to potential scenarios during the summer months and consider putting their fans back in. Just sayin'. BTW, the Cup cars in Group 7 didn't bitch about the pace speed and I made them go just as slow or slower. In fact, I had to pass three of them to pick up the race leader. Amazingly, the leader knew that and had already slowed significantly in response to the flags and workers, so I was able to catch him quickly.

ShadowBolt
03-25-2009, 11:18 AM
If we are not going to slow way down we may as well race in all but the area where the problem is (single yellow rules). To me it (the DY) does nothing if we are going to run 9 tents waiting for the problem to go away. If the tow truck has to come on track to go get Jeremy and someone misses the Swiss the potential for hurting someone is greater than if we are all out there going 5 tents. What is gained by going at racing speeds? Had I understood better I could have easily stayed with James until we were green again. All I want now is to understand what is correct. I can tell you that if I have corner workers at every station trying to get me to slow down I will continue to do what they want. Maybe there is something they know that race controll does not know yet and they are trying to help me. If it causes me to lose a position or two in the race....so be it. If you are behind me you will get screwed.

JJ

rpoz27
03-25-2009, 11:23 AM
Yes, I heard Clifton say that track rules require a DY when an extraction is in progress. And MSRC is the only track that has that administrative rule and it's probably driven by insurance.

Could also be based on worker complaints. If rescue at TWS felt at risk because a group of drivers weren't slowing appropriately, we would change our policy on extractions for that group.

evarner
03-25-2009, 11:24 AM
What was the radio chatter like during the double yellow? Were the corner workers reporting in that no one is slowing down even though all of them were pushing their hands down as we passed 'em in a motion as to indicate "slow the hell down"?

Everywhere I've read and learned since 2001 regarding double yellow's is to slow down and no passing. Do I need to relearn this rule?

I agree that my threshold is much lower. But, when a DY is out, we should all be on the same page. Is it worth running 9/10ths? Are we putting racing above safety? Seeing a rule or event change due to a tragic accident isn't what this series is about. We need to be proactive not reactive.

If I'm lagging behind mentally and you guys have this figured out, please accept my apology. 8)

rpoz27
03-25-2009, 11:40 AM
What was the radio chatter like during the double yellow? Were the corner workers reporting in that no one is slowing down even though all of them were pushing their hands down as we passed 'em in a motion as to indicate "slow the hell down"?

I don't recall any workers reporting anything about you guys going too fast. They did the "slow the hell down" gesture any time there was a DY.

evarner
03-25-2009, 11:47 AM
What was the radio chatter like during the double yellow? Were the corner workers reporting in that no one is slowing down even though all of them were pushing their hands down as we passed 'em in a motion as to indicate "slow the hell down"?

I don't recall any workers reporting anything about you guys going too fast. They did the "slow the hell down" gesture any time there was a DY.

Thanks. :D

I'm sure this is being discussed and we will have a resolution in short order.

jeffburch
03-25-2009, 12:02 PM
Whatever happened to the info broadcast :?:

:x

jb

Rob Liebbe
03-25-2009, 12:39 PM
I saw Clifton walking through the grid prior to one of our races motioning to each car if they were on the safety broadcast radio. It didn't look to me like he got a single positiive response. I know that I gave up on it a while ago.

mitchntx
03-25-2009, 01:33 PM
Whatever happened to the info broadcast :?:

:x

jb


I saw Clifton walking through the grid prior to one of our races motioning to each car if they were on the safety broadcast radio. It didn't look to me like he got a single positiive response. I know that I gave up on it a while ago.

JB ... you crack me up ...

RL ... it's circus. Now, Clifton is saying "I tried the IB at Cresson and no one was on it, so why bother?"

And we all went through all the hoopla to install radios, do a comm check, put on all the gear only to hear white noise. So why bother?

Consistency ...

Waco Racer
03-25-2009, 03:24 PM
RL ... it's circus. Now, Clifton is saying "I tried the IB at Cresson and no one was on it, so why bother?"

Don't put words in my mouth.

mitchntx
03-25-2009, 04:00 PM
RL ... it's circus. Now, Clifton is saying "I tried the IB at Cresson and no one was on it, so why bother?"

Don't put words in my mouth.

Must ... resist ... response ....

http://admiralrupert.googlepages.com/kirk.jpg

AI#97
03-25-2009, 05:21 PM
I have great in car video from last year going out of wagon wheel pedal to the floor during DY waving at the corner workers! Good stuff!

Now let's consider an incident that NEARLY happened. Morgan at TWS last year. Local yellow so the cars are still moving quickly but he didn't see the swiss flag till last minute, nearly clips the EV and bails track out tearing his car to hell. I don't see that bad situation being any different from a DY.

also, why is the rule on DY and local yellow different as to when to slam the gas down? Local yellow is when I can see the next flag station which could be 1/4 mile from it....DY is perpendicular to the station? Am I missing something here? Did I violate that rule and had actually passed Daron before the S/F prior to BB because I saw there was no yellow all the way back in tombstone?

Just bouncing things around for thought but the idea of full tilt boogie under DY doesn't seem to make sense for me...but will do what the clown in front of me is doing...if there is someone in front of me. If I am lead car, count of 50% pace or 60mph max....yes, my speedometer still works.

Al Fernandez
03-26-2009, 08:21 AM
Clifton, please elaborate...21.1 is adjustments by the race director.

I agree with you guys; double yellow should not be full speed. IMHO during DY the session leader (who damn well better know who he is, part of the responsibility of being out front, like pacing the warmup and start) should slow to pace speed (2nd gear, 3000rpm) quickly but safely and stay at that speed. Everyone else should drive at a reduced but fast pace, observing the caution area and reducing speed significantly through that area, mainining 100% control a tall times until they catch the guy in front. Absolutely no passing unless passing emergency vehicles or a pace car with a point by.

That would minimize the need for a pace car, bunch the field quickly so as to maximize "open track" for the crews, and set up for good restarts.

Losing the lead you've built...tough shit.

Clifton, is that about right?

mitchntx
03-26-2009, 08:32 AM
should slow to pace speed (2nd gear, 3000rpm) immediately and stay at that speed. Everyone else should drive at a reduced but fast pace, observing the caution area and reducing speed significantly through that area, maintaining 100% control a tall times until they catch the guy in front. Absolutely no passing unless passing emergency vehicles or a pace car with a point by.


Some real world data that can be used by a driver while on track. There is hope for you yet, Fernandez.

I can live with 3K in second for DYs

evarner
03-26-2009, 09:07 AM
Can we make this official?

GlennCMC70
03-26-2009, 09:09 AM
2nd gear at 3000 rpm's is a different speed for each platform.
there should be a suggested speed, and its up to the driver to calcutate that into what gear and what rpm.

for pit road, i havea sticker on my wheel that says 2nd @2K.

plenty of gear calulators out there that will give this info.

Alien
03-26-2009, 09:18 AM
2nd gear at 3000 rpm's is a different speed for each platform.

True, but there is only one leader. Word it so the leader is in 2nd at 3000. Everyone else just has to follow.

Think they are just looking for a small range of speed, not an exact mph.

jeremiahkellam
03-26-2009, 09:38 AM
Clifton, please elaborate...21.1 is adjustments by the race director.

I agree with you guys; double yellow should not be full speed. IMHO during DY the session leader (who damn well better know who he is, part of the responsibility of being out front, like pacing the warmup and start) should slow to pace speed (2nd gear, 3000rpm) immediately and stay at that speed. Everyone else should drive at a reduced but fast pace, observing the caution area and reducing speed significantly through that area, mainining 100% control a tall times until they catch the guy in front. Absolutely no passing unless passing emergency vehicles or a pace car with a point by.

That would minimize the need for a pace car, bunch the field quickly so as to maximize "open track" for the crews, and set up for good restarts.

Losing the lead you've built...tough shit.

Clifton, is that about right?

I guess I'll chime in since it seems like I'm the one that messed up.

I was leading when we came out of Big Bend and saw the DY. From Al's video you can see I (and Al) slowed before the start finish. Once we got to the top of the hill and saw Jeremy's car, we slowed way down (I think there was even some debris on track I was trying to avoid near Jeremy's car. After we came out of Wagon wheel, I noticed Gleen and Rob were on it. Here is my thought process:
On Saturday, Mulder and I (and someone else was there??) had a conversation about running 40 minute races. Mulder had the idea of bringing out a DY at the 20 minute mark (competition yellow). He also said that may cause problems taking too long for the field to get bunched back up. As stated earlier, Clifton said any yellow would be treated as a DY because of the off track conditions. So as I rounded Wagon wheel and saw the DY at the next station, I did not speed up. By this time Al was nearly pushing me down the straight to little bend. So I start thinking more... If Glenn and Rob are trying to catch up to the CMC field, what about the CMC guys behind me, is it fair to hang back 50 lengths. Could we have seperate restarts like Grand Am?? After running for my life for a few laps there, dialing it back to 80% felt like we were creeping, so I felt comfortable slowing at start finsh, getting pass the wounded car, and then picking it back up.

It was another trial by fire for the rookie at MSRC. I asked both JP and Al after the race if I handled that situation properly and they said they were fine with it. Sorry if anyone else didn't approve, I'll make sure to handle it better next time I'm leading and the DY comes out... :wink:

mitchntx
03-26-2009, 09:39 AM
2nd gear at 3000 rpm's is a different speed for each platform.
there should be a suggested speed, and its up to the driver to calcutate that into what gear and what rpm.

for pit road, i havea sticker on my wheel that says 2nd @2K.

plenty of gear calulators out there that will give this info.

At 3K in 2nd gear, I bet there isn't 5mph difference in speed between all the combination. The accordian effect will be more than that.

The guy at the tail end of the train might be 3K in 3rd gear ...

Todd Covini
03-26-2009, 09:45 AM
Jeremiah,
This isn't an isolated case. We've had this "fast double yellow" where the field never bunches back up before.

From the tower, we want to see a single file restart @ start/finish, but for the racers that can chew up some track time...that's why we resist sending the pace car if it's not needed.

I'm all for an agreed upon 3k in 2 (not to be confused with BFT on 3) for the overall leader. Good way to self manage and prevent a Corvette, M3 or SVT Focus pace car from jumping out there to slo yo asses! :wink:

Todd Covini
03-26-2009, 09:47 AM
Mitch is right....3k in 2 is likely too slow.
Maybe 3k in 3.

Al Fernandez
03-26-2009, 10:31 AM
Jeremiah...you were leading your class, but not the session. Your responsibility IMHO is to safely catch up to the car in front of you.

3k in 3rd is faster than can be maintained through all corners. More importantly, the faster the session lead goes, the faster everyone has to go to catch up.

MSR-C is 1.7 miles. The CMC track record is 1:24. Thats an average of only 73mph. With a lead car going ~50mph, a guy that was at the tail end of the lead lap would take over five minutes to catch up going track record speeds! The only realistic way to bunch the field is to have the session lead run true pace speed.

jeremiahkellam
03-26-2009, 11:35 AM
Just for reference, according to my Traqmate, our laps under DY were:

1:35 (catching up to pack) about 90% of the race pace but only about 85% of AI pace, they were the session leaders...
1:58
1:57

AllZWay
03-26-2009, 11:58 AM
Jeremiah...you were leading your class, but not the session. Your responsibility IMHO is to safely catch up to the car in front of you.


That is my understanding and thought as well. As long as you are not 100% and not passing anyone, then you would be within the rules.

I think it really should be the responsibility of the overall race leader to slow to allow the field to catch up safely or the pace car to catch the field and slow them to allow the field to catch up.

ShadowBolt
03-26-2009, 12:48 PM
Clifton, please elaborate...21.1 is adjustments by the race director.

I agree with you guys; double yellow should not be full speed. IMHO during DY the session leader (who damn well better know who he is, part of the responsibility of being out front, like pacing the warmup and start) should slow to pace speed (2nd gear, 3000rpm) immediately and stay at that speed. Everyone else should drive at a reduced but fast pace, observing the caution area and reducing speed significantly through that area, mainining 100% control a tall times until they catch the guy in front. Absolutely no passing unless passing emergency vehicles or a pace car with a point by.

That would minimize the need for a pace car, bunch the field quickly so as to maximize "open track" for the crews, and set up for good restarts.

Losing the lead you've built...tough shit.

Clifton, is that about right?

I guess I'll chime in since it seems like I'm the one that messed up.

I was leading when we came out of Big Bend and saw the DY. From Al's video you can see I (and Al) slowed before the start finish. Once we got to the top of the hill and saw Jeremy's car, we slowed way down (I think there was even some debris on track I was trying to avoid near Jeremy's car. After we came out of Wagon wheel, I noticed Gleen and Rob were on it. Here is my thought process:
On Saturday, Mulder and I (and someone else was there??) had a conversation about running 40 minute races. Mulder had the idea of bringing out a DY at the 20 minute mark (competition yellow). He also said that may cause problems taking too long for the field to get bunched back up. As stated earlier, Clifton said any yellow would be treated as a DY because of the off track conditions. So as I rounded Wagon wheel and saw the DY at the next station, I did not speed up. By this time Al was nearly pushing me down the straight to little bend. So I start thinking more... If Glenn and Rob are trying to catch up to the CMC field, what about the CMC guys behind me, is it fair to hang back 50 lengths. Could we have seperate restarts like Grand Am?? After running for my life for a few laps there, dialing it back to 80% felt like we were creeping, so I felt comfortable slowing at start finsh, getting pass the wounded car, and then picking it back up.

It was another trial by fire for the rookie at MSRC. I asked both JP and Al after the race if I handled that situation properly and they said they were fine with it. Sorry if anyone else didn't approve, I'll make sure to handle it better next time I'm leading and the DY comes out... :wink:

Jeremiah,

I was not even thinking about you. I don't think you did anything wrong I just think there is a better way. This was my first DY ever in a race and it's my fault that when I saw the DY that I slowed so much that you and James got thirty car lengths ahead of me. When I realized everyone was going way faster than I was I tried to catch up. I ran almost WFO (ask Mitch if you don't understand) and never caught all the way up to you guys. Don't worry about anything you did lets just make it better for next time.


JJ

Todd Covini
04-23-2009, 10:40 AM
I know this isn't Grand Am, but for reference...here's what the GA rules say about a full course yellow and bunching up the field.

GRAND AM RULES
Safety/Pace Car –
9-4.1 The Race Director may dispatch the safety car at any time during an event to neutralize the racing and correct a hazardous situation on course. The safety car will be dispatched following the activation of the in–car Delphi caution lights and the display of double yellow flags at all corner stations. The pit entrance is closed at once at this time..

9-4.2 All cars must continue to respect the flag signals around the course and exercise extra caution in the area of the full course yellow incident. Otherwise all cars must close up to the rear of the line of cars behind the safety car as quickly as possible

9-4.3 Where possible, the safety car will be dispatched in front of the leader. It is the responsibility of the lead car to reduce speed to a level that will allow the safety car to safely enter the track in front of the lead car as well as allow the balance of the competitors to close up in single file in the shortest time possible. On the initial out lap or
as soon as the race director deems it safe to do so, the safety car will wave by any cars in front of the leader in order to achieve this.

mitchntx
04-23-2009, 10:50 AM
With limited or non-existent in-car communications, how does the lead car knows he or she is driving the lead car?

Slowing to allow safe entry for the pace car risks losing positions.

Our pace car is a freaking C5 Z06 ... STAND ON IT JC!!!!!!!!

BlueFirePony
04-23-2009, 10:55 AM
With limited or non-existent in-car communications, how does the lead car knows he or she is driving the lead car?

Slowing to allow safe entry for the pace car risks losing positions.

Our pace car is a freaking C5 Z06 ... STAND ON IT JC!!!!!!!!
This should be handled by the corner workers noting the lead car's number on the board and displaying it as soon as the DY comes out.
That solves it for the lead car, the car's immediately following and for all cars being waved by.

Al Fernandez
04-23-2009, 11:04 AM
how does the lead car knows he or she is driving the lead car?

Slowing to allow safe entry for the pace car risks losing positions

I think 90% of the times the session lead has no excuse for not knowing if they are the session lead. That said, this is yet another great example why an information broadcast and ability to hear it ought to be required.

If the pace car is about to come out, the double yellow has already been thrown. Therefore, there is no risk of losing positions.

AI#97
04-23-2009, 10:02 PM
so two events in a row this has been an issue. Clifton made it perfectly clear in the Sunday Driver's meeting, that DY equals 40% pace behind the lead car of the session.

Maybe that needs to be reiterated at each driver's meeting for the folks who weren't there this past weekend. I do like Brian's idea of the corner stations pointing out to the lead car of the session with a thumbs up or a point so they know they are lead car. Usually it will be me :wink: but if group 7 is there, it may require more work.

Funny how my statements on 3/25 came to fruition in R1 Saturday Morning.... :lol:

jeffburch
04-23-2009, 10:15 PM
Our pace car is a freaking C5 Z06 ... STAND ON IT JC!!!!!!!!
Who stopped to gander a lost bird dog :lol:

jb

David Love AI27
04-24-2009, 07:56 AM
Our pace car is a freaking C5 Z06 ... STAND ON IT JC!!!!!!!!
Who stopped to gander a lost bird dog :lol:

jb

DON'T GET ME STARTED!!!! DUMASS CAME TO A COMPLETE STOP!!!!!

AllZWay
04-24-2009, 08:03 AM
Our pace car is a freaking C5 Z06 ... STAND ON IT JC!!!!!!!!
Who stopped to gander a lost bird dog :lol:

jb

In his defense, we weren't really sure where that dog was going.

Also...Who else saw the deer in R1....I thought I was about to plow one, but I think Glenn's exhause scared him and made it turn back where it came from. :lol:

Both the dog and the deer were in turn 7.

AI#97
04-24-2009, 08:18 AM
Our pace car is a freaking C5 Z06 ... STAND ON IT JC!!!!!!!!
Who stopped to gander a lost bird dog :lol:

jb

In his defense, we weren't really sure where that dog was going.

Also...Who else saw the deer in R1....I thought I was about to plow one, but I think Glenn's exhause scared him and made it turn back where it came from. :lol:

Both the dog and the deer were in turn 7.

Saw the deer...when patterson put two off passing Mitch they stopped, did a 180 and shot back into the trees.

David Love AI27
04-24-2009, 08:57 AM
Our pace car is a freaking C5 Z06 ... STAND ON IT JC!!!!!!!!
Who stopped to gander a lost bird dog :lol:

jb

In his defense, we weren't really sure where that dog was going.

Also...Who else saw the deer in R1....I thought I was about to plow one, but I think Glenn's exhause scared him and made it turn back where it came from. :lol:

Both the dog and the deer were in turn 7.

that dog was all the way back to the tree line, we were crawling along at 45mph... BESIDES it was not his responsibility... the corner workers had it under control...

Al Fernandez
04-24-2009, 09:01 AM
I saw the deer while following you James and I immediately started thinking how I might be able to use them as a pick! Unfortunately they turned back. :wink: :lol:

michaelmosty
04-24-2009, 09:25 AM
I saw the deer while following you James and I immediately started thinking how I might be able to use them as a pick! Unfortunately they turned back. :wink: :lol:
I thought the same thing! :lol:

AllZWay
04-27-2009, 11:57 PM
I saw the deer while following you James and I immediately started thinking how I might be able to use them as a pick! Unfortunately they turned back. :wink: :lol:

That is just wrong. :P