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View Full Version : How to regrease SN95 hubs.



marshall_mosty
12-06-2011, 11:22 PM
http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_01.jpg
Assembled Front Suspension

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_02.jpg
Remove 36mm Axle Nut

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_03.jpg
Turn Bearing over to access back side

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_04.jpg
Richard Pedersen made this trick tool at NASA, but you can also use a screwdriver between the inner and outer race to pop the rear race off.

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_07.jpg
Rear Race removed

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_08.jpg
Rear Race removed (2nd shot)

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_09.jpg
Pry on rear bearing cage to remove rear grease seal

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_10.jpg
Rear bearing cage and grease seal being removed

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_13.jpg
View of front race from behind

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_14.jpg
Use 1 1/8" socket to tap out front race

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_15.jpg
Remove front race.


http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_16.jpg
Pop out each of the ball bearings from the front bearing cage with a small flat blade screwdriver.

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_17.jpg
Clean everything with brake cleaner so you don't mix grease

http://1985mustanggt.com/Misc/SN95_Hub_Re-Grease_18.jpg
Regrease with your favorite synthetic racing grease

jdlingle
12-07-2011, 09:18 AM
Awesome write up Marshall! The pictures are defeinitely helpful. Is it worth buying the tool? How often do you regrease yours before replacing? Grease every year?

And how many tries did it take you to get your bumpsteer corrected?:shock:

ShadowBolt
12-07-2011, 10:30 AM
Thanks Marshall for posting this. I am going to remove the one I borrowed from Sam at TWS (thanks Sam) this weekend and redo my old ones. I will get yours back Sam via UPS next Tue.

JJ

RichardP
12-07-2011, 12:20 PM
As a heads up, I recommend pulling apart the hubs and regreasing them before you ever run them. Every hub that I ran for a while then regreased still failed. I've never failed a hub that was set up with proper grease from the start. The hubs that are on the car currently have been on there for a long time. I haven't pulled them apart to freshen them up either...


Richard P.

marshall_mosty
12-07-2011, 08:36 PM
Regarding buying the "tool". I wouldn't. I just used Richard's cool tool to say I did. You can do the same thing with a flat blade screw driver and hammer in less time.

I agree with Richard. My hubs get stripped and regreased before ever hitting the track. I have two seasons on them and they are still fine. It's a function of the grease quality. After next season I will flip the bearings from the inner race to the outer race to even the wear.

I do carry an extra hub, just in case.

marshall_mosty
12-07-2011, 08:37 PM
...how many tries did it take you to get your bumpsteer corrected?:shock:
About six. I ended up with about as much spacer stack as I could fit with the wheel... :)

marshall_mosty
12-07-2011, 08:39 PM
How often do you regrease yours before replacing? Grease every year?
I buy them, grease them, run them for 2 seasons, flip the bearing balls and run another 2 seasons...

RichardP
12-08-2011, 09:29 AM
I have two seasons on them and they are still fine. It's a function of the grease quality.

My memory is a bit fuzzy at this point but I believe my current front hubs were installed in late '04. Before I started using good grease on fresh hubs, they would last about a year.


Richard P.

ShadowBolt
12-08-2011, 09:37 AM
Can you purchase the grease seals? I removed a hub at TWS and there was grease all over outside the hub.

JJ

RichardP
12-08-2011, 10:50 AM
Can you purchase the grease seals? I removed a hub at TWS and there was grease all over outside the hub.

JJ

No, you can't buy any parts for the hubs since they are "non-serviceable." Be very careful taking them apart.

The reason I got into regreasing the hubs in the first place is because I had a pair of hubs with such thin and crappy grease that it melted and flung out all over the place. It was everywhere including the brake discs, calipers, inside the wheels, etc. My brakes faded away at TWS and I had to come in to see what was wrong. Proper grease stays inside the hub. A grease seal is to keep contaminants away from the grease, not to hold the stuff in...


Richard P.

marshall_mosty
12-11-2011, 07:36 AM
No, you can't buy any parts for the hubs since they are "non-serviceable." Be very careful taking them apart.

The reason I got into regreasing the hubs in the first place is because I had a pair of hubs with such thin and crappy grease that it melted and flung out all over the place. It was everywhere including the brake discs, calipers, inside the wheels, etc. My brakes faded away at TWS and I had to come in to see what was wrong. Proper grease stays inside the hub. A grease seal is to keep contaminants away from the grease, not to hold the stuff in...


Richard P.

I 100% agree with Richard. If you start with new hubs, you will have ZERO issues getting the seal out. Use a seal puller and be gentle if you are regreasing used hubs. If they were new on your race car and just have a season on them, they still should come out pretty easily.

MHISSTC
12-11-2011, 11:22 PM
Thanks for posting this info. I was planning on doing exactly this in the next few months before getting the car on-track next season.

MHISSTC
04-01-2012, 02:27 AM
Questions about the spindle nut...

All instructions I have seen say to replace the nut after each removal. Are you reusing the nut or replacing it with a new one each time you take it off?

There appears to be two different style replacement nuts available...the more expensive caged OEM style as shown in your picture that is $20 each at the Ford dealership, and the non-caged type for the low price of $5 each at Autozone. Any recommendation?

It looks like I'll be hitting the parts store on Monday to pick up a 36mm socket. I'll have to check my torque wrench to see if it goes up to 250ft.lbs. to get that nut back on tight.

Scott

Wade
04-01-2012, 10:22 AM
I re-use the factory nut.

jdlingle
04-01-2012, 11:29 AM
Me too. Only changed the hubs once but no issues so far.

BlueFirePony
04-01-2012, 04:54 PM
Slight thread hijack. Need to replace the front hubs on BFP and was looking to use the ARP studs...other than OEM or Timken if you have suggestions on hubs let me know. I need to contact Timken and make sure the ARP studs will work.

edrock96GT
04-01-2012, 08:38 PM
Slight thread hijack. Need to replace the front hubs on BFP and was looking to use the ARP studs...other than OEM or Timken if you have suggestions on hubs let me know. I need to contact Timken and make sure the ARP studs will work.

See the Cresson media thread for hub & stud info (where else would it be...duh). I got the O'Reilly hubs and rear studs from summit and drilled the holes with a 39/64th bit. Turned out great.

marshall_mosty
04-02-2012, 09:06 AM
Scott,
I see no problem reusing the ford spindle nut. I've never had it back off. Use a breaker bar and body weight to achieve 250 ft-lbs of torque.

Brian,
On the hub, I'm not sure what the OEM knurl size is for the S197 platform, but the ARP 7703 studs have a 0.625" knurl. The 39/64 is 0.609, with provides a perfect press fit. I'd hammer out an existing stud and measure the knurl on the OEM studs. If it's equal or less than 0.625", go with the 7703's from ARP. Stay away from Moroso, too many disaster stories.

BlueFirePony
04-02-2012, 11:23 AM
Thanks Marshall. The Ford Racing hubs are basically the OEM with ARP studs so it might just be cost effective to go that route...S197 price points are still damn high :(

MHISSTC
04-02-2012, 03:19 PM
Good Info.

Thanks all.

MHISSTC
04-03-2012, 03:10 AM
Since I'm the guinea pig of our team, I disassembled and cleaned my first hub and I think it might be FUBAR'd for a couple of reasons.

The hubs I am trying this on are used OEM Ford units of unknown mileage that came on the set of used '94-'95 GT spindles we purchased.

First potential issue: The back cover was super easy to remove with the special CMC Parts tool. As I was wiping a little bit of the grease out before popping the bearing and seal out, I noticed a very small piece of fibrous stuff. I think it is a small piece of the inner lip of one of the plastic races that was missing and had gotten all smashed up with the bearings. There is a small piece of this thin inner lip missing on each of the races and each one is also cracked and detached from the rest of the race for about 1/3 of the circumference around each race. I'm not sure this thin lip is doing anything, but I'm not sure I want to go ahead and reuse it either. I'm wondering if I should trim the rest of the somewhat detached portion off and go ahead and use it, or if should I give up now and get a set of new hubs to re-grease?

Second potential issue: The seal required a little more effort than it should have to remove, probably because it is a used hub, and I also made the mistake of prying up from underneath the seal instead of from underneath the bearing race. I ended up putting a bit of a wave in the seal. I am not confident I can straighten it out. Again, should I give up now and get a set of new hubs, or should I expend the effort to try to flatten the seal and reuse it?

I'm going to make my teammate Dave do the second one with whatever small amount of guidance I can give him after doing the first one. I guess if he has any issues with the second hub, we'll be buying a new pair anyway.

The next thing we'll practice is drilling the hubs out for the ARP studs.

Wade
04-03-2012, 08:56 AM
The tiny piece on the innner portion of the plastic bearing retainer is only there told hold the entire assembly together in the box during shipping and installation. Basically an assembly line type of product where the can cram it all together and get it to stick. You can carefully pull that tiny peice out and discard it. The rear seal is just a dust seal. You should be able to easily pound it back flat and reuse it. Don't give up. It took me a couple of hours to do the first one, but now I can disassemble, clean and repack in about 20 minutes. The drilling is also no big deal as you are only enlarging the hole from .595 to .609 so just go slow and it will be fine. Good Luck!

MHISSTC
04-09-2012, 04:47 PM
The bearing retainer was trimmed, the dust seal was flattened and all was assembled.

I managed to break the drill bit when drilling the second hub as I got hung up on the ABS ring. We got another bit, went slower with less pressure, and it worked much better.

The proof will come this weekend when we get it on the track.

centerville
03-14-2018, 01:03 PM
Sorry to dredge up an old post but it's a good one. Marshall any chance you still have the pics you took for this. Thanks

marshall_mosty
03-14-2018, 02:20 PM
Probably not, but I might be able to grab a hub this weekend and post fresh pics.

RichardP
03-14-2018, 03:13 PM
As a heads up, the center bore on S197 hubs is larger but the design is the same. I was able to machine the other end of my tool to pull apart those hubs for greasing...

Richard P.

marshall_mosty
03-14-2018, 05:01 PM
As a heads up, the center bore on S197 hubs is larger but the design is the same. I was able to machine the other end of my tool to pull apart those hubs for greasing...

Richard P.

I've always just used a flat blade screwdriver between the two inner race halves to tap the inner race out and then use a socket on the outer race.

centerville
03-14-2018, 09:35 PM
As a heads up, the center bore on S197 hubs is larger but the design is the same. I was able to machine the other end of my tool to pull apart those hubs for greasing...

Richard P.

I paid attention when you said that last weekend. But as I have never done this pics are worth 1000 words. I might steal your design and make my own once I see what I am supposed to be doing.

centerville
03-14-2018, 09:40 PM
Probably not, but I might be able to grab a hub this weekend and post fresh pics.

If you want me to pick one up and you can show me and I will take pics and save for future reference. It doesn't have to be this weekend. Google drive has it's perks.

marshall_mosty
03-15-2018, 09:50 AM
If you want me to pick one up and you can show me and I will take pics and save for future reference. It doesn't have to be this weekend. Google drive has it's perks.
I have a few "old" hubs that I can pull apart for the pics. I need to run by the shop Friday anyway and will pick it up. Maybe I can email you the pics to host on Google Drive.

centerville
03-18-2018, 06:20 PM
Rock auto has so many different hubs. Does it matter which one I order as I repacking them?

drecords
03-18-2018, 10:23 PM
Rock auto has so many different hubs. Does it matter which one I order as I repacking them?

I think I bought the SKF ones for ~$55 each. SKF is a good bearing, I don't trust the china stuff.

RichardP
03-19-2018, 07:31 AM
Rock auto has so many different hubs. Does it matter which one I order as I repacking them?

I've bought several different brands. They have all had Koyo stamped on them...


Richard P.

Sook
04-26-2018, 12:34 AM
Sorry to dredge up an old post but it's a good one. Marshall any chance you still have the pics you took for this. Thanks

Did you ever get pics? I have a set arriving next week that I'm going to setup for the car, I can take some photos if you still need them.

- Josh

centerville
04-26-2018, 04:58 PM
Never got any pics. I would appreciate any pics you could take Josh.

centerville
06-29-2018, 08:52 PM
Ok I replacement hubs now. I can see how I can get the dust cover off the outside bearing. But I have no idea how I should approach the inside bearing. Anyone care to share so I don't screw them up. I got skf bearings if it matters. TIA

Sook
06-30-2018, 03:19 PM
Here's a picture of the tool Richard P. made. I tried to take out the dust seal from the back of this bearing, but it didn't come out properly. Insert the wedged part of the tool into the inner race of the bearing, make sure not to grab both races. Apply some bending moment to the tool and it should pop out easily. pull all the guts out and the outer race should also pop out easily, sometimes even without the tool. Regrease with your grease of choice!

1797
Hub opening tool. One side is for SN95+ hubs, the other is s197 hubs.

1796
Tighten the wedge bolt.

1795
Dust seal didn't come out properly. I was able to tap this ring back in to cover the dust seal without issue.

I ended up with Timken branded bearings this time around. I wasn't able to get them apart at all, even after using implements of great force. The last set that I did for my S197 were very easy to take apart, so I guess these are different some how. I would not recommend these bearings for CMC. They might have already failed after Hallett, so maybe I'll get to take better pictures soon.

- Josh

centerville
06-30-2018, 10:05 PM
Thanks Josh! I have work to do now.

Supercharged111
07-01-2018, 05:53 PM
Man, that looks way more involved than the 4 bolts that hold my hubs on.

Fbody383
07-02-2018, 12:04 PM
Man, that looks way more involved than the 4 bolts that hold my hubs on. Show a picture of all the receipts with the hubs... maybe use them as a shim.

centerville
07-04-2018, 04:47 PM
Here's a picture of the tool Richard P. made. I tried to take out the dust seal from the back of this bearing, but it didn't come out properly. Insert the wedged part of the tool into the inner race of the bearing, make sure not to grab both races. Apply some bending moment to the tool and it should pop out easily. pull all the guts out and the outer race should also pop out easily, sometimes even without the tool. Regrease with your grease of choice!

1797
Hub opening tool. One side is for SN95+ hubs, the other is s197 hubs.

1796
Tighten the wedge bolt.

1795
Dust seal didn't come out properly. I was able to tap this ring back in to cover the dust seal without issue.

I ended up with Timken branded bearings this time around. I wasn't able to get them apart at all, even after using implements of great force. The last set that I did for my S197 were very easy to take apart, so I guess these are different some how. I would not recommend these bearings for CMC. They might have already failed after Hallett, so maybe I'll get to take better pictures soon.

- Josh

Josh

Do you have a pic of what all comes off so you can clean and repack bearing? Having never seen a bearing exactly like this I'm not sure what all gets removed. With the karts what you showed in the one pic is all you removed to dissemble the whole bearing. Thanks

Sook
07-05-2018, 10:47 AM
I think I have a broken one I can take a picture of somewhere. You'll end up with a grease seal, inner race, inner ball bearings and cage, the outter ball bearings and cage, and the outer race.

When you get the inner race out it should look like this: https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=imgres&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiuvPzvpYjcAhVH3VMKHfe_Ai4QjRx6BAgBEAU&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.motoiq.com%2FMagazineArticles %2FID%2F893%2FProject-Silvia--The-Official-Guide-to-Not-Screwing-Up-Your-Wheel-Bearings-Like-I-Did.aspx&psig=AOvVaw2wsNduvZjUfpscraRu4YFg&ust=1530891627225766

Then just start pulling the ball bearings out. The whole thing basically falls apart once a few of the balls are out.

- Josh

centerville
07-05-2018, 11:07 PM
Thanks the pics were just what I needed. Now to get some good hi temp grease. Thanks again.