Jordan Motorsports MSRC weekend

As you have seen in another thread Jay was passing Dan for the lead in R1 and we had a little issue. In this race Jay posted the fastest lap of the weekend for CMC (1:23.3) as far as I know. After this we had a broken AST strut (what a POS) lower ball joint fell out, brand new wheel torn up, right fender torn all to hell, another front bumper cover gone, inner tie rod bent, bump steer end link bent ..... I bought a stock strut and Dan welded in the ball joint. John was nice enough to let us borrow half of a bump steer kit. I did a halfass toe adjustment and did not touch the caster/camber. Jay qualed P1 Sun. morning with BL P2 right behind him by a tenth or less. That was Team Jordan's first pole in a Toyo race and BL's first front row start. Jay got a poor start (spun the tires) and BL was gone. Halfway through the race BL was pulling away by about 10 car lengths and driving an almost perfect race (he did not go off tack even once......yet). Finally due to a very slow and very dangerous Legends car (the CMC leaders lapped him three times) Jay was able to get even with Bryan and out brake him going into Rattlesnake. BL locked the brakes up and slid off track left. Now Jay had to hold off Dan and Tyler for fifteen minutes. Tyler could not just work on Jay he had to worry about Dan and in some places that would let Jay pull away by four or five car lengths. He did a great job and I'm a proud Daddy! R4 since Jay won I had to start last. Most of the field was sleeping at the start and since I could not even see the flag when Jay yelled "green green green" on the radio I took off. I got by all but two cars by the exit of Big Bend. I had a hard time getting around John Martin but he finally went into Horseshoe a little hard and slid out. We went all the way to Rattlesnake side by side but I had the right side going in so I was able to get by. Then it was just a matter of holding off a faster Tyler for the balance of the race. Tyler had to worry about Dan who kept sticking his nose in so somehow I was able to win R4. I want to thank Tyler who was much faster for racing me so clean. We went through Big Bend several times side by side all the way to Rattlesnake but I never gave up the right side so he could not get around. Hell even Dan and I went through Big Bend side by side and he did not hit me (it was close though and I was told my wife said "oh no, not Dan again" LOL). So other than having a torn up car it was a good weekend. We very well should have won three of the four races and who knows what could have happened in R2 that we did not even make it on track for?

I'm not going to say what changes we made to the car but I can tell you the new engine was not it. We only pulled 250/295 on the Dyno at the track. If the change that made this difference was what I assume it was I feel like a fool for not taking advantage of this sooner. I know most of you always have and I assumed it did not really make that much difference. Maybe that had nothing to do with it and we just got lucky. The part I do not understand is how I can install a stock Auto parts strut on the right side and have the car drive exactly the same as with the AST. We could not tell a difference at all.



JJ

Sticker tires.

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Originally Posted by Rob Liebbe

Sticker tires.

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Yes but we were not the only ones on new rubber.

JJ

I was pretty frustrated with dealing with out of class BS all weekend. The slow legends car was on the top of the list, I believe it was the same one that caused me to blow a really good lap 2 during qual, was deep into the 1:25s and was on track for my best lap ever before Mason and I had to shut it down for him towards the end. Pissed me off to no end.

Even after all of the hooplah in R3 and the repeated discussions we've had about out of class racing, I again caught him in rattlesnake, staying in line with not a care in the world that 6500lbs of car (Josh and I) was hurtling towards him.

Wasn't happy about stuff that happened with an AI car or two during races but that was more or less resolved.

What ever happened to the 4th race group (Autobahn) and being able to spread out the racing classes so we aren't cramming so much into one group and running over tiny cars? The RX-7 guys and most of the front half of the legends group were great to work with and I felt bad that we have such a huge speed delta on the straights while they're trying to race too, the faster legends cars would catch up and pass the tail end of CMC as well...

Huge congrats to Jordan Motorsports! I was extremely impressed with Jerry on Saturday getting the car back together-great display of being a race car mechanic and not giving up. Yes my daughter told me he was over there yelling a few times but kudos for not putting it on the trailer and heading home. Pretty sweet for both Jordan's to win on the same day-now just think if you were a two car team. Wish I would have been able to enjoy Jay's Toyo win at impound but I had some of the same feelings he had during R1 and had to let my frustration with the Legends car subside. Relaxed with some music in the garage (thanks Mark!) and was okay. Then saw video (thanks Tyler) that Jay and I weren't even close made me really happy for Jay. What ticked me off the most was that was the same car that was horrendous in practice on Friday and this is when you could only pass in the straights. I told our race director it didn't need to be on track with us as it was dangerously unaware of what was going on track and didn't seem to know there was even a raceline. Otherwise the RX7's and Legends were great to run with.

Rob-they have run sticker tires plenty but the main thing is they felt it was the best the car had ever felt.

Pranav-they have separate groups for all the DE's now so less race groups. Our days are numbered unless we get new street porsches with personalized plates related to road racing.

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Originally Posted by Pranav

I was pretty frustrated with dealing with out of class BS all weekend. The slow legends car was on the top of the list, I believe it was the same one that caused me to blow a really good lap 2 during qual, was deep into the 1:25s and was on track for my best lap ever before Mason and I had to shut it down for him towards the end. Pissed me off to no end.

Even after all of the hooplah in R3 and the repeated discussions we've had about out of class racing, I again caught him in rattlesnake, staying in line with not a care in the world that 6500lbs of car (Josh and I) was hurtling towards him.

Wasn't happy about stuff that happened with an AI car or two during races but that was more or less resolved.

What ever happened to the 4th race group (Autobahn) and being able to spread out the racing classes so we aren't cramming so much into one group and running over tiny cars? The RX-7 guys and most of the front half of the legends group were great to work with and I felt bad that we have such a huge speed delta on the straights while they're trying to race too, the faster legends cars would catch up and pass the tail end of CMC as well...

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First, thanks for a great weekend to all! 250 entries at Cresson going as smooth as it did (overall) is a win in my book as an event operator. Was really cool to see the big AI group!

In regards to Pranav's questions;
1) Out of class racing. In club racing, especially with the overall size of the NASA program, it's going to have to happen and it's something that we're all going to have to work through together. The issue with the Legends car that Pranav mentions isn't because it's not a V8 American car, it's a driver training issue. Driver's in mixed car groups need to develop the rapport to be able to walk into each other's pit space and talk about these things like adults, not just complain about them on the forums after the event. Even World Challenge, IMSA, LeMans, Nurburgring, and Daytona 24 hour have multiple classes on the track at the same time of very different speeds. It works and there are challenges, but it is what it is and we all take the good with the bad.

2) Why Lightning/Autobahn groups disappeared. Basically, for the last 3 years there hasn't been a consistent enough group of regulars in either Lightning or Thunder to justify either of them getting their own run group. So we gave a try to splitting what was a combined 3/4 group into their own groups. This has consistently given us more entries than Thunder and Lighting/Autobahn having their own group and then there's only so much time in the day to build a schedule so that's why it came to this.

Having participated in every single 25 Hour and growing up in NASA's home region where literally every single race group is a mixed class group, I think it's a very fun dynamic of amatuer racing that you can choose to either love or hate, either way you'll get both the good and the bad dealings from time to time. Sometimes you benefit from a pick maneuver, sometimes you lose a position from someone else setting up a pick, and every once in a while the pick takes out all 3 cars. This happens even with only one class on track. It's all about being able to have the conversation with the driver's creating an inappropriate challenge, or addressing it with a NASA official at the event so we can get the driver conduct issue corrected to minimize the bad that comes with mixed group racing.

I hope this helps with understanding the reasons these challenges exist. Thanks for a great weekend, everybody!

-WF

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Originally Posted by nasawill

In regards to Pranav's questions;
1) Out of class racing. In club racing, especially with the overall size of the NASA program, it's going to have to happen and it's something that we're all going to have to work through together. The issue with the Legends car that Pranav mentions isn't because it's not a V8 American car, it's a driver training issue. Driver's in mixed car groups need to develop the rapport to be able to walk into each other's pit space and talk about these things like adults, not just complain about them on the forums after the event. Even World Challenge, IMSA, LeMans, Nurburgring, and Daytona 24 hour have multiple classes on the track at the same time of very different speeds. It works and there are challenges, but it is what it is and we all take the good with the bad.

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I was overly communicative about the issues, as were other drivers, to our RDs, as we have been told not to approach other drivers directly about issues but rather let the RDs handle it. In the past this meant if the RD got a complaint about a specific driver, the RD brought it up in general in the driver's meeting, then sought the specific driver in question to help figure out whatever issue it is.

The out of class racing issue was brought up in general during the driver's meeting, but again in R3 and R4 a couple of very specific examples continued to behave as if nothing was discussed.

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2) Why Lightning/Autobahn groups disappeared. Basically, for the last 3 years there hasn't been a consistent enough group of regulars in either Lightning or Thunder to justify either of them getting their own run group. So we gave a try to splitting what was a combined 3/4 group into their own groups. This has consistently given us more entries than Thunder and Lighting/Autobahn having their own group and then there's only so much time in the day to build a schedule so that's why it came to this.

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This is truth. We can't as a group bargain if we aren't bringing high attendance numbers. We have a number of cars that will begin to show up as the season progresses so I'm hoping we get closer to our own run group again; we did great with PT at MSRH but that was a different track with different dynamics.

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Having participated in every single 25 Hour and growing up in NASA's home region where literally every single race group is a mixed class group, I think it's a very fun dynamic of amatuer racing that you can choose to either love or hate, either way you'll get both the good and the bad dealings from time to time. Sometimes you benefit from a pick maneuver, sometimes you lose a position from someone else setting up a pick, and every once in a while the pick takes out all 3 cars. This happens even with only one class on track. It's all about being able to have the conversation with the driver's creating an inappropriate challenge, or addressing it with a NASA official at the event so we can get the driver conduct issue corrected to minimize the bad that comes with mixed group racing.

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I supposed part of my frustration is I would "pick to lose" when I see 3-5 legends cars coming up behind me very quickly and very obviously racing. Before this happens the CMC car behind me would have a much wider gap, then I'd move aside just enough to give them safe room to pass without screwing up their race, and the other CMC car gets right behind me; in one case two of my in class cars behind used this out of class traffic to swoop right by me because I was positioned wrong to let an out of class train by.

I guess I'll need help learning how to "pick" better.

Anyways I've said my piece on this already. Looking ahead at the schedule and Thunder attendance numbers for TWS, COTA, Hallet, MSRH, and TWS again, I don't expect to be "bunched up" with a bunch out of class cars on a small/tight track again anytime soon so you won't see much more whining on my part.

Moved

JJ

Congratulations Jay and Jerry!!
That's awesome stuff and I'm even more sorry I wasn't there to witness it.

What did you change then if it wasn't motor, a stock strut, and sticker tires??

Michael and I suspect they had a really good breakfast.

Wait...did they stay up drinking until 4am??

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Originally Posted by Al Fernandez

Wait...did they stay up drinking until 4am??

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Yeah right.

JJ

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Originally Posted by Al Fernandez

What did you change then if it wasn't motor, a stock strut, and sticker tires??

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I promise your car already takes advantage of what I'm talking about. You are way to hard to pass for me to tell you anything. Of course when you don't show up........

JJ

Z06 wheels are how wide again? :)

Great drives from both the Jordan's!!

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Originally Posted by ShadowBolt

I promise your car already takes advantage of what I'm talking about. You are way to hard to pass for me to tell you anything. Of course when you don't show up........

JJ

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You finally got shock shaft spacers to allow full droop?

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Originally Posted by Pranav

Michael and I suspect they had a really good breakfast.

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Wheaties - just like Bruce Jenner!!!

Who? Is he related to Caitlyn Marie Jenner?

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Originally Posted by Al Fernandez

Who? Is he related to Caitlyn Marie Jenner?

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Let's just hope Jerry doesn't show up to the awards banquet in a little black dress.

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Originally Posted by Rob Liebbe

Let's just hope Jerry doesn't show up to the awards banquet in a little black dress.

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"Little" black dress?


JJ

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Originally Posted by Pranav

Michael and I suspect they had a really good breakfast.

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Interesting-I had the same pancakes with them for breakfast-Thanks Kathy! First time I have been on the front row of a Toyo race or led during a Toyo race, too.

So it was the pancakes... from Jerry's earlier jab at Al, I think you are just calling him fat.

Fat or not we're still no closer to an answer

He had a set of special tires that were matched perfect and staggered special... He took the outside and it did hold... he drove right by him. LOL

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Originally Posted by marshall_mosty

He had a set of special tires that were matched perfect and staggered special... He took the outside and it did hold... he drove right by him. LOL

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Perfect!!!

Congratulations on the weekend guys. I removed the RF after damage, maybe that helped a little...