This is what happens when a Porsche breaks on track and doesn't pull off the racing line.
http://youtu.be/ntCrh-DRXsE
This is what could have happened at cresson had the track not been built on flat land.
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This is what happens when a Porsche breaks on track and doesn't pull off the racing line.
http://youtu.be/ntCrh-DRXsE
This is what could have happened at cresson had the track not been built on flat land.
It absolutely baffles me that someone would pull off with a mechanical at the exit of a blind turn. Having said that, I have a hard time judging based on that one view. He did have a car behind him that passed him on the inside, and he had enough room after that pass to get over to the inside, but it's hard to tell what speed he was at after the first car passed him. Either way, if he hit the brakes and intentionally slowed down at that point on the track, it wasn't the best idea. Any other videos of this incident?
Somebody still have Marshall's stop at Cresson on video? Similar situation but with better outcome - luckily. Put it up as another example of what can happen.
I believe it's in the '06 video... It was as far off as I could get, given where the fuel pump died... Still a bad situation that was make "okay" by several fast thinking individuals (namely my brother).
this is why I'm relucatant to throw stones at the car that broke... if that's what happened.Quote:
Originally Posted by marshall_mosty
As the following driver it's not like he shouldn't have been looking up and through the corner to see the stranded car. View did not seem to be blocked.
It's also easy to sit here behind a computer and say why did so and so do X in this situation. I think it's also great to watch incidents like this as it makes you think what you would do in a similar situation. We'd all like to do the right thing, but there are so many other things going on while driving in a race that doing what should be done doesn't always happen.
What bothers me most is they pass 5 or so manned corners stations. None of which appear to be showing a yellow of any sort..... I watched several times in slow motion and the last station before the car appears to have both flaggers looking down stream a the car, but no flags. Maybe just can't see it.
Unfortunately, the Z that rolls appears to be one of our own guys from NOLA.....
Here is another incident at the start of Sundays race.
http://youtu.be/-CaZBOxzB04
commentary I saw was that the Porsche was rolling to a stop just as the Z came up and through T5. Maybe the T5 station could've gotten a yellow out in time, but if that's true I can't put any blame on the stations upstream.Quote:
Originally Posted by nasa-rm
Just offering what I know as a way to help us sharpen between events what we should be doing/thinking/etc when we have the helment on - if it gets even one person thinking/acting in better ways that leads to avoiding something like this in the future then I'm happy. :)
This is why I typically always comment in our driver's meeting about always having an out. Know where you are on track and the direction of travel your car would, or would not want to go in the event you couldn't stay on the racing line.Quote:
Originally Posted by blk96gt
This also can be traced back to BL's contact with Ben at Cresson. Brian's car naturally wanted to track out (exiting a left hander) and since Ben's car was taking up 3/4 of the track sitting sideways, Brian made the best decision for what his car could do and have the possibility of avoiding contact. What Brian didn't know at the time was Ben's car was sliding off track.
It is. BUT, having the conversation every time puts another piece of the plan into play when you're in the car. I think the Z should have been able to see the Porsche at track right - I think I see the Z loose once he realizes he doesn't have track out and is more worried about giving up the spot. Pure speculation.Quote:
Originally Posted by blk96gt
Should Brian have seen Ben up track and made a decision, within the pressure of a race for position, to check up some to have more alternatives if/when Ben fails to recover?
Having had more contact than I would like, I try to learn from these things - where am I going? If things go south where will I end up? Should I give up the spot/drive off/risk-reward? Is it a scratch or a totaled race car?
I'm with Balingit and see a lot of corner workers that seem to be standing around. The guys on the downhill side of the sign would have had the best warning with a waving yellow - but they couldn't see, so did they know?
I like all the discussion so as a group we can avoid more of these.
Now, with the same lack of visible flags replace the Porsche/racecar with an EV - everybody still as racy?
view from the Z - would've been tough to spot the strand-ing/stranded car being up the ass of the Audi like that
http://youtu.be/Sah_RX8A7cU
And it seems it was shielded more by the car ahead of the Audi. i.e. at 45-47 seconds of that video. Which also seems to show no flags of any kind.Quote:
Originally Posted by kbrewmr2
Then between 3:38 and 3:45 there looks like an edit - around 3:38 it looks like two cars pass the porsche off line right. Were there enough visual clues in real time? Very hard to throw big rocks from here, especially during a race for position, but it's good info for the racecraft data bank.
Here's the view we all wanted to see!
http://youtu.be/Sah_RX8A7cU
Notice he gets hit again by a Miata afterward.
if you really want to throw stones... different run group but Formula Atlantic plows into car that had been stopped and covered by a waving yellow for at least 1min
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76tpyNwHRGQ
Been watching this thread and not wanting to step in and let it run its course. Wanted to let you guys talk through the process.
Talking about every contact no matter how big or small is always a good thing. Being able to talk to the other party involved as well as answer hard questions asked towards yourself if your found at fault in a non-defensive manner goes a long ways to full understanding for both POV.
We have all the safety stuff for the things that can happen that we cannot control/prevent. Most of the time we test/use that safety gear in instances where what got us in the bad spot could have been prevented as it was in our control to do so - very hard for anyone to admit sometimes. But sometimes, an odd situation comes about that just could not be anticipated. It was perhaps beyond our control. To me, this looks like a bad situation that could have been much worse. I can feel fairly confident the driver that flipped had no chance to see it coming or react to it. When you race 10/10's, those are the situations you have to be willing to accept when it happens.
For the driver of the stalled/stopped car. Until we know his story, we don't know more than half at best. Perhaps a mechanical caused him to stop there by no decision of his own (locked rear diff for example). How long was that car sitting there? The corner that could see him can't waive a yellow, he's not at or past that station. They may have been calling it in and explaining the issue. That takes time and more time for control to call back to the appropriate corner station and request a yellow. This could easily take 1-2 minutes. An eternity when your the driver of the car stalled/stranded.
Love that you guys want to talk about this type stuff. Very glad none of this got heated and a good healthy debate was allowed to happen.
The Porsche lost a transmission and it literally just came to a stop when he got hammered.
Here's another one from the same weekend.
http://youtu.be/76tpyNwHRGQ
I assume he got hit again there at the end? Then he gets out with cars still running on track. I guess he was tired of getting hit?
JJ
Yah he's lucky he didn't get hit while he was standing!
It looked like he had just taken his belts off when he got hit the second time.
First wreck ?'s. What are the possible scenario's/protocols/reasons why a yellow could have been thrown prior to the wreck? From the video it looked like there was a car off pace which I assume was the porsche but it didn't seem that far off? So would a slower car or off pace car cause a yellow to be thrown? I'm feeling a little confused. Seems like if a yellow is thrown then they can't pass the slow/disabled car? At first I thought the car was off line and over the curbing but I don't know the track so it looks like they may use that as part of the line. Would love to hear some input using this situation as a guide but maybe some other assumptions of what could happen. Also curious on the corner worker protocol. Where is the line drawn that allows them to instantly start waving a yellow before calling it in?
2nd wreck-My understanding is to stay in the car without unstrapping everything. Where it might get dicey is if it's on fire.
I got out of my car when I saw some smoke from under the hood, but I had also driven it way off track and behind a wall so I knew I was in a protected area. Additionally, I had always practiced getting out of the car by opening the door first. After the wreck, the driver's door would not open causing a delay getting out.
Good reminder Rob. Sounds like we need to have a vehicle exit test after on of the sessions at TWS. :^)
That can be arranged...Quote:
Originally Posted by michaelmosty
dude, you have me on ignore or something?? LOL! 2nd time this thread you've posted the same video I did...Quote:
Originally Posted by Suck fumes
As someone who started getting into this by cornerworking.Quote:
Originally Posted by BryanL
Something happens in your station, you put the flag out ASAP first and foremost. That situation *has* to be communicated to oncoming drivers immediately if not sooner. You then radio back to control what's going on (simple spin, no big deal, or hey heavy impact and then let them make the call to increase severity with a FCY, red to allow EV to roll sooner, or whatever).
Something that happens upstream of you that may be blind to the station that does control that area you would have to relay via radio - causing some lag unfortunatley. If it were me I'd call the station direct and tell them "Turn __ go waving yellow" then make a 2nd call to control to let them know why but again the most important thing is to get the communication via flags to oncoming drivers.