At the very least Go over the rotor with a buffer pad on a wiz wheel air tool really well and or resurface them. I know first hand going from a hawk to a Carobotech pad does not mix well! The car wouldn't stop worth a flip.
At the very least Go over the rotor with a buffer pad on a wiz wheel air tool really well and or resurface them. I know first hand going from a hawk to a Carobotech pad does not mix well! The car wouldn't stop worth a flip.
In short, if you are going to a pad with a significantly different operating range, material or bite you will want to resurface your rotors at a minimum and make sure your rotor's operating range (factoring in the resurfacing) matches the pad's. If you are going to an almost similar pad, then clean, scuff and check for wear, resurface if needed.Originally Posted by marshall_mosty
In long.....
When you change pads, make your rotor surface as much like new as you can.
A clean hard surface with directional edges (if you have slots, cross drilled or even partial drill) meets brand new consumable gritty surface. Look for high spots on your rotors, any cracks.
Also, if the pad and rotor temp range changes you may need to adjust how you cool the brakes and how you brake to take advantage of the pads/rotor behavior. Combinations of pads, calipers and rotors can create totally different behaviors.
If you go with the R4s they can operate with good bite from 400F or so to 1000F. Other pads need to be kept cool and some like to run hot. Where do your rotors run the best and how long do they take to cool/heat?
The APF02s I ran had better bite through their entire range than any other brake pad I tried (spec'd at .6 coeff of friction all things considered equal) but really grabbed in a range of about 575-850F. They also required less cooling to keep the bite higher but also cost twice what the R4s do. I ran several different sets of rotors (mostly slotted, some cross-drilled) most could not keep up with the pads and warped or cracked quickly. Changing the way I ducted the brake system could have helped. The DBA4000 (and then the 5000) were the only ones that could mate up with the APR pads. I raced almost exclusively on DBA and APR (some Mintex). I did a lot of trial and error in TT and DE sessions (probably over $3k in products).
When I was at a track (ECR) that lent itself to me being very aggressive coming off my brakes the pads needed to release fast so I used a specific pad that had great initial bite and came off the rotor quick - that's not just the pistons in your caliper..that's the behavior of your rotors and pads as well. Most pads did not release as fast as the APRs or the Mintex.
With the loose-is-fast setup I often needed to temper my release and some pads would overheat. A set of Mintex F4R (similar to the APF02) had a wider operating range (similar IIRC to the Porterfield R4) and had great initial bite and very consistent through braking, and required less cooling...and about twice the cost - $280-300).
Glenn, for the non-abs Camaro setup like Misty has, we prefer the PFC01's (now the PFC 11) but there is a lot of initial bite. We tried a set of 06's and you can hammer the hell out of them as there is less initial bite and they modulate VERY nicely. We ran them for a weekend at Hallett and they barely show wear. Misty prefer's the 01's and we keep these 06's as spares, along with a ton of Hawk DTC-70's from a former life.
I think you would be happy with the 06 or the DTC-70. The 70 is probably pretty close to an 06 but a LOT cheaper....however, I personally can't stand Hawks and find I can overheat them pretty easily.
One thing you need to keep in mind is the stoptech rotors are MUCH more efficient at cooling than the factory stuff you have been running so don't be afraid of a pad that works in the higher heat ranges. If you are a hard charger under braking or are looking to catch up to the trophy girls, you are going to need a brake pad that can take the abuse and not fade toward the end of the race.
Misty said she might cut you a deal on these lightly used 06's if you are interested in trying them.
Ah, fugg it.
I was wrong. I just looked back and I am running the 11's not the 06's. I really could not tell that much difference in the 11's and the 01's but you can get on the 11's harder without lock-up.
With tax, I paid almost $400.00 for a set!
JJ
Holy cow!! The 01's were around $275/set. I guess it is not that bad considering I get 5 events out of a set. An extra $200 / year isn't that bad if you love the pad.
-Michael Mosty
CMC #11 Mosty Brothers' Racing
Director - TX Region
I think the R4 may be the way to go. Several fast guys run then and they are at a good price.
JJ
Damn...and I thought I was spending $ on pads....I know the PFC calipers for the S197 were pretty expensive (comparatively) but they also perform well from what I've heard (I know..not for CMC).
I'd definitely look at the R4 (not the E -unless you are running an enduro)
They had a price increase. I was paying under $300.00 plus tax and now they are like $389.00.
JJ
I'm going to try Carbotechs in the rear instead of Azone golds. Rotors are fine but I don't like having them resurfaced after trying that and having them crack. What do I need to do to clean up the rotor? I'm not sure what kind of buffer pad you mean or a wiz wheel. Obviusly not the kind of buffer pad for detailing a car's paint. Any cleaners, scoth brite, emory cloth type of stuff to use to clean up the surface?
Do I need to do this when running the same carbotech compound on a used rotor?
Bryan Leinart
CMC #24
If they cracked on resurfacing they were either resurfaced wrong or they maybe were gonna crack soon anyway. Check the rotor thickness and condition before handing them off and you should be comfortable having them resurfaced.
Cleaning the rotor is never a bad thing - if your pad requires bedding it's better to do with a clean rotor than a crapped up one. It really takes very little time.
You want all the spent pad material and any other crap off the rotor regardless of whether it is same pad material or not.
What I do:
A variable RPM tool like a circular buffer (not orbital, unless you want to chase it around) or sander makes it quick and easy using a gritty pad > 200 < 1500 - say 600 - it really depends how much crap is built up. I've seen people approach this like prepping a car for clear...using 1000grit followed by 1500 grit. Hmmm...I usually use more course.
If you do it without power, use a block...don't use your fingers.
You want a relatively low speed or you just might glaze the crap on instead of cleaning it off - start low and even and if it can handle more speed, pick it up. Should go quickly.
Just make sure you don't dig an edge and groove/gouge -have the rotor clamped flat so you can work it evenly. After I am done and it looks clean I dust and rub talcum powder onto the surface and take the wheel to it one last time to check for high spots and cracks. Then wipe with mildly soapy (like 4 drops/ pint) water and dry or use +90% isopropyl alcohol
My rotors have never failed me....yet. :/
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