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Thread: Houston results changes for CMC

  1. #1

    Houston results changes for CMC

    Prior to the recent Houston event, John Martin made some changes to his engine setup and needed a new dyno cert. His plan was to dyno at the track on Friday, but it turned out the dyno there was out of commission so he was unable to test. We sealed his hood at the end of the weekend and its taken a bit of time to set up a time to run the tests, which we finally did this past Saturday. Unfortunately John broke over the limit on the dyno. We'll have NASA official results changed to reflect John as having fun run the weekend and not collecting points. However, since we are so close to the deadline for Toyo bucks, and since many of you have already submitted your forms, we will not make that change until after the Toyo submittal window passes. Instead, John will submit forms for his current finishing positions and will distribute cash to those impacted.

    Here is the way I see it, please chime in with corrections:
    R1
    Gary Robertson moves up to 3rd and is owed $50
    Daniel Records moves up to 4th and is owed $100

    R2
    Craig McCormick moves up to 2nd and is owed $200
    Daniel Records moves up to 3rd and is owed another $100
    Sean Richardson moves up to 4th and is owed $50
    Kent Wiseman moves up to 5th and is owed $100

    Checking my math...the above adds up to $600, which is what John will be submitting forms for; 3rd in R1 and 2nd in R2.
    Al Fernandez

  2. #2
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby
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    Ok-I'll be the one to ask what everyone else would want to know. How much power did his little 302 make? Kudos to all involved in being a good sport to seal the hood and get an official dyno. Sorry you went over John.
    Bryan Leinart
    CMC #24

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by BryanL View Post
    Ok-I'll be the one to ask what everyone else would want to know. How much power did his little 302 make? Kudos to all involved in being a good sport to seal the hood and get an official dyno. Sorry you went over John.
    272hp and 302trq, with my post race weight I was 5hp over. I'm now restricted down to 263hp and 296trq. Still better torque then I've ever had, so I'm happy with that. Not so much about blowing the dyno. I'm sorry for causing the group any trouble but will do my best to make it right.

    John

  4. #4
    Something I've been thinking about and since its rules change request I guess I'll throw it out there:

    Has there been any thought of sealing access to the fuel tank at the end of the weekend as well as the hood? Its possible that someone whos hood is sealed could go home
    and add fuel into the tank increasing their weight and offsetting the overage of hp and/or tq when the car is dynod.

    I'm not after anyone in particular, just thinking out loud as we had a Rocky Mountain CMC racer in a similar situation. I know we cant remove all of the what ifs but this seems like a pretty
    easy thing to do and would remove an easy opportunity to boost the weight to meet the hp/tq rules.

    Thoughts?

    Regarding our little 302 (now 308) Mustang engine, three years ago I dynod and got my numbers right where I wanted them to not have to add additional weight. No changes were made over the winter and prior to the next season starting I dynod like 10hp and 10-15tq over whats allowed. Strange how the numbers can change with zero adjustments being made from one season to the next.

    Dave

  5. #5
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby ShadowBolt's Avatar
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    Great idea Dave.

    On the engine making more power at a later date....how much of that is because an engine gets broken in, loosens up or the rings seat completely? No issues with too much power running the 4.6.


    JJ

  6. #6
    Thoughts on sealing the computer as well? I think Dustin had mentioned the idea to me when also sealing the hood.

    Sorry this is getting off topic, I can start another thread or do a rule change request if y'all think its got some legs to stand on.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby Rob Liebbe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BADVENM View Post
    Has there been any thought of sealing access to the fuel tank at the end of the weekend as well as the hood? Its possible that someone whos hood is sealed could go home
    and add fuel into the tank increasing their weight and offsetting the overage of hp and/or tq when the car is dynod.
    The only "official" scale is the one at the track when you go to tech after a race. Adding fuel to increase weight at the dyno time should not be a relevant factor.
    Rob Liebbe - Texas Region
    Camaro, Mustang, doesn't matter to me, I'll race it.

  8. #8
    That's correct Rob. We weigh the car at the track post race, not at the dyno later. Had it been a fuel injected car we would also have sealed the computer and OBDII ports. I should've said right at the onset that John was great throughout. Sorry you couldn't keep those results John.
    Al Fernandez

  9. #9
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby
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    Quote Originally Posted by martinsntx View Post
    272hp and 302trq, with my post race weight I was 5hp over. I'm now restricted down to 263hp and 296trq. Still better torque then I've ever had, so I'm happy with that. Not so much about blowing the dyno. I'm sorry for causing the group any trouble but will do my best to make it right.

    John
    Thanks John. Great example of a gentleman and a gentleman racer making things right and fair. This is the kind of people I enjoy racing and hanging out with at the track.

    Good questions Dave. Is your 302 carb or FI? Same dyno? Have you checked another dyno? What was the weather difference between the two dyno days? Apparently the further you get away from the SAE corrected weather readings the less accurate the correction factor. We experienced this in Houston one year dynoing on a very cold day-I had to go to smaller plates that cut about 15-20 hp off when I went back to another dyno and others had a similar experience. Of course with a carb the numbers could fluctuate pretty good based on weather I think, too.
    Bryan Leinart
    CMC #24

  10. #10
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby
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    Quote Originally Posted by BryanL View Post
    Thanks John. Great example of a gentleman and a gentleman racer making things right and fair. This is the kind of people I enjoy racing and hanging out with at the track.
    Totally, John was very upfront about it right from the start of the weekend. I would be worried about running a carb and inconsistent numbers. My EFI car has been on 3 different dynos (all in DFW though) and run with 4 different motors and always been within 5hp.
    Tyler Gardner
    CMC #13 2015-2017
    SM #013 2018
    www.dfwmustangs.net

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