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Thread: Diff Cover Drain

  1. #21
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby
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    Also quick show of hands, who is going to DEs, test days, and other racing events outside of the NASA calendar? How many of you guys are changing alignment settings and spring rates between races?

    Is your car showing up to the track Friday completely ready to go?

    If you're answering no to some of these, go see if the guys in front of you answered less "NOs" than you, maybe fix that too?
    Last edited by Pranav; 06-27-2018 at 08:43 PM.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pranav View Post

    We should put Tyler in my car and see how far up he can place vs the big evil Fox mafia.
    I would love to run a 4th gen for nats , thought about building one but don't have time
    Tyler Gardner
    CMC #13 2015-2017
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    www.dfwmustangs.net

  3. #23
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    Well that did not work.
    Last edited by centerville; 06-27-2018 at 10:14 PM.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by BryanL View Post
    Agreed it's GM biased towards the rearend....of the field.

    Had to make a change after the 2016 results in Texas with Fords winning 83% of the podiums, every Toyo race, and every fast lap of the weekend.

    2017 got it back in line with 2015's 72% Ford podiums. For 2017 Ford had 75.36% of podiums, every fast lap of weekend, but GM did get a single Toyo win.

    2018 so far is right in line (but revisions may need to be reconsidered). Fords have won 73.33% of the podiums, but only 7 out of 8 Toyo races, and they have 3 out of four fast lap of the weekend.

    But to keep this on topic are we allowed to run an aftermarket aluminum cover? What if said cover has some bolts to help the carrier bearing in the ultrastrong GM diff? What if the bolts are backed out so they don't provide any support? At least we are allowed to upgraded to the superior Ford 8.8 or Ford 9" with better posi and gearing options. Guess I need to do that swap instead of adding a diff cover with a drain.

    There it is, what I have been missing. LOL. Now it feels like every other motorsport I have been involved with. Sorry Brian I get the frustration and I don't even have a gm. Not sure why they would shoot down a simple mod like that. Tyler is right file it again. OK carry on.

  5. #25
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby
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    Pranav-did someone hack your account? You sound exactly like all the GM guys did 8 years ago when the Fords were complaining but none of them did any testing and they all ran the same spring setup. What's cool is now the Fords did what the GM guys did a long time ago. Now you have say 3 Fords at a given event running the fastest lap times which are basically the same lap times but what's so interesting is that those three normally have all totally different suspension setups, spring rates, etc.
    Remember just because it's a coilover doesn't mean it's 10 times better than a traditional shock and spring. Same goes for the torque arm which is so weak and flexes. Sure you have aftermarket setups for Fords that put in a torque arm and aftermarket setups on F body's that add a 4 link type of setup.

    I'm not complaining or submitting RCR's. I just enjoy sharing the same data that was used way back when to give the Fords an advantage only now the data is totally reversed.

    I also enjoy showing how ridiculous some things are like not being able to run an aluminum diff cover for $150 that gives more strength, fluid capacity, and cooling but I can swap in a Ford 9", GM 12 bolt, or Dana...yet I can't swap in the Mustang 8.8.

    Pranav-to answer your questions everyone knows between you and Dan the 4th Gen gets more time time testing away from NASA events and on Friday's. I probably do more than the Summer Shootout Winner but not sure why any of that matters.
    Last edited by cjlmlml; 06-28-2018 at 09:59 AM.
    Bryan Leinart
    CMC #24

  6. #26
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby michaelmosty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BryanL View Post
    Pranav-did someone hack your accoutn? You sound exactly like all the GM guys did 8 years ago when the Fords were complaining but none of them did any testing and they all ran the same spring setup. What's cool is now the Fords did what the GM guys did a long time ago. Now you have say 3 Fords at a given event running the fastest lap times which are basically the same lap times but what's so interesting is that those three normally have all totally different suspension setups, spring rates, etc.
    Remember just because it's a coilover doesn't mean it's 10 times better than a traditional shock and spring. Same goes for the torque arm which is so weak and flexes. Sure you have aftermarket setups for Fords that put in a torque arm and aftermarket setups on F body's that add a 4 link type of setup.

    I'm not complaining or submitting RCR's. I just enjoy sharing the same data that was used way back when to give the Fords an advantage only now the data is totally reversed.

    I also enjoy showing how ridiculous some things are like not being able to run an aluminum diff cover for $150 that gives more strength, fluid capacity, and cooling but I can swap in a Ford 9", GM 12 bolt, or Dana...yet I can't swap in the Mustang 8.8.

    Pranav-to answer your questions everyone knows between you and Dan the 4th Gen gets more time time testing away from NASA events and on Friday's. I probably do more than the Summer Shootout Winner but not sure why any of that matters.
    I know this is all in good fun but you really need to get your facts in line. 8 years ago Jeremiah and I both had cars prepped to the Max of the rules and were testing our brains out trying to get the leg up on the other. What you are thinking of is 12 years ago when we were all brand new to this and virtually none of the Mustangs did true testing and analysis. The rules changes took place after the 2012 season to change the weights of the platforms and get the track widths closer to being equal.

    My car has been setup well for a long time now so my lack of Friday practice is a non-issue.
    Also, think about getting the most out of your car when you are racing and have 60% of your focus on hitting all your marks, 20% of focus on your car and any potential issues, and 20% focus on everyone else on track. Car prep and mental prep is vital to getting the most out of your performance.
    Now flip that focus to 90% hitting your marks, 5% on your car, and 5% on other drivers on track and tell me who you think is going to be faster.
    No offense to Marshall but it is the reason he was running slower in his car at the end of his racing career vs 5 years prior. He was spending so much mental energy focusing on a car that had constant problems, that the driving performance suffered.
    -Michael Mosty
    CMC2 #11 "Mosty Brothers' Racing"
    2011 TX Region - CMC2 Champion

  7. #27
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby
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    Quote Originally Posted by BryanL View Post
    Pranav-did someone hack your account? You sound exactly like all the GM guys did 8 years ago when the Fords were complaining but none of them did any testing and they all ran the same spring setup. What's cool is now the Fords did what the GM guys did a long time ago. Now you have say 3 Fords at a given event running the fastest lap times which are basically the same lap times but what's so interesting is that those three normally have all totally different suspension setups, spring rates, etc.
    Remember just because it's a coilover doesn't mean it's 10 times better than a traditional shock and spring. Same goes for the torque arm which is so weak and flexes. Sure you have aftermarket setups for Fords that put in a torque arm and aftermarket setups on F body's that add a 4 link type of setup.

    I'm not complaining or submitting RCR's. I just enjoy sharing the same data that was used way back when to give the Fords an advantage only now the data is totally reversed.

    I also enjoy showing how ridiculous some things are like not being able to run an aluminum diff cover for $150 that gives more strength, fluid capacity, and cooling but I can swap in a Ford 9", GM 12 bolt, or Dana...yet I can't swap in the Mustang 8.8.

    Pranav-to answer your questions everyone knows between you and Dan the 4th Gen gets more time time testing away from NASA events and on Friday's. I probably do more than the Summer Shootout Winner but not sure why any of that matters.
    I think 5 years of staying at the Mustang Ranch at Hallett is rubbing off me.

    All I'm saying is I'm just not seeing the "Max Effort" push by the 4th gen drivers that I see the Mustang drivers doing right now, or guys are putting in the Max effort but have incidents/failures that hold them back. I'm guilty just as anyone else in the 4th gen camp.

    As far as different setups, it is reversed; most of the 4th gens now are running similar rates while the mustangs are all over the place. Go look under Josh's car and see if you can even see any springs up front.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby Fbody383's Avatar
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    One of these days we'll keep threads clean.

    Isn't it about time for a nation-wide CMC convention to re-think what CMC needs to be going forward? It's completely against the ideals of the old 230hp rules to allow $$$$$ brakes, but not $ diff cover.

    Quote Originally Posted by michaelmosty View Post
    Now flip that focus to 90% hitting your marks, 5% on your car, and 5% on other drivers on track and tell me who you think is going to be faster.
    I put myself into this camp - my 9.9 effort is equivalent to a 9.0 effort by a trophy queen. I just don't have any processing room left at this point. Some is probably set-up, some is very likely lack of seat time. I think the rules are close though personally I still vacillate between close and not close enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pranav
    All I'm saying is I'm just not seeing the "Max Effort" push by the 4th gen drivers that I see the Mustang drivers doing right now, or guys are putting in the Max effort but have incidents/failures that hold them back.
    You can say that about me and it doesn't bother me. I struggle whether I should make the investment in the time/cost balance to move up the field a couple of places. OR... keep having a great time with some great folks with a little racing thrown in for good measure.
    #39 CMC Camaro
    Orange is Fast!
    CMC-NT01 FTW!

  9. #29
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelmosty View Post
    I know this is all in good fun but you really need to get your facts in line. 8 years ago Jeremiah and I both had cars prepped to the Max of the rules and were testing our brains out trying to get the leg up on the other. What you are thinking of is 12 years ago when we were all brand new to this and virtually none of the Mustangs did true testing and analysis. The rules changes took place after the 2012 season to change the weights of the platforms and get the track widths closer to being equal.

    My car has been setup well for a long time now so my lack of Friday practice is a non-issue.
    Also, think about getting the most out of your car when you are racing and have 60% of your focus on hitting all your marks, 20% of focus on your car and any potential issues, and 20% focus on everyone else on track. Car prep and mental prep is vital to getting the most out of your performance.
    Now flip that focus to 90% hitting your marks, 5% on your car, and 5% on other drivers on track and tell me who you think is going to be faster.
    No offense to Marshall but it is the reason he was running slower in his car at the end of his racing career vs 5 years prior. He was spending so much mental energy focusing on a car that had constant problems, that the driving performance suffered.
    Extremely good points in the second paragraph. But I really like this quote from the 39 that sums it up pretty good for me. "You can say that about me and it doesn't bother me. I struggle whether I should make the investment in the time/cost balance to move up the field a couple of places. OR... keep having a great time with some great folks with a little racing thrown in for good measure."

    Mosty-I wasn't around 12 years ago as I was still in high school. But yes I'm having fun sharing the same type of data that was used in the past. Sounds like it was 6-8 years ago with what we are talking about when the threads were all about parity. After 2012 the directors took away track width from the 4th gens I think and they specifically threw a bone to the Fords reducing weight by 50 lbs. Of course they used data from you and Procter from one race as well. What has changed on your car since 2012? More power?, Stoptechs?, AST's? etc? Want to test drive my car for a day at Cresson before Nats?
    Bryan Leinart
    CMC #24

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Pranav View Post
    I'm looking at 4th gens in Texas in general, and I'm seeing all kinds of issues that prevent each particular driver/car combo from running up front. Be it breaking things unexpectedly, reliability, or the driver just not doing enough testing/setup time to win.

    I'm not trying to put my fellow 4th gen drivers down, but spend an afternoon observing what the Fox guys are doing vs the 4th gen guys in regards to what they're focused on (or even present) on Fridays before the race, and you may see my point. I feel like the combination of new/fresh talent on the Mustang side, the departure of Proctor/Landrum, and the timing of the rule changes all happening at the same time seems to perpetuate the impression that there is an apparent rule bias against 4th gens.

    The RMR guys are saying mustangs are getting their butts kicked by Camaros up there.

    Yeah the Mustangs have a weight advantage, but they have shit aero and suspension.

    Francis has been able to put his car far up there from time to time when it has run right and it (no offense) has the least fanciest gear of the others. Tyler hopped in Sean's car (3rd gen, but still) and was able to put it up there at COTA after working on setup.

    My car's been running like a swiss watch and has all of the right parts/numbers to win, but I haven't been put it together as a driver to get it done myself.

    At this point performance wise I'm (by choice) weighing 50lbs over post race (I have more than enough extra gas and coolsuit capacity to take it down to zero if needed), and getting closer and closer to 260/310 with the new motor after making tweaks. All that's needed is setup time and a good driver.

    We should put Tyler in my car and see how far up he can place vs the big evil Fox mafia.
    Honestly I think Bryan Curtis showed all of us at Hallett that a well set up 4th gen is as fast as the foxes. He was absolutely favored to win going into the championship race. As I came out early due to old ass foxbody issues I don't know how the race ended like it did...but his car appeared well sorted and fast all weekend...
    Last edited by drecords; 06-29-2018 at 10:54 AM.
    Daniel Records
    CMC # 34

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