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Thread: Future of CMC: A wish list

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by 64GunPilot View Post

    I really hope the class holds together. I love my car, and I love the spirit of CMC (even though I haven't per
    See you guys at Hallett. Would love some in car coaching if anyone has the time.
    I'd also be willing to ride in the death seat but since I'm not an annointed NASA instructor they might not allow it.
    Daniel Records
    CMC # 34

  2. #32
    Been watching these threads over the past few months but have shied away from offering my opinion (imagine that). I loved CMC and only went to AI as I liked the development aspect, what I knew I’d miss was big fields and close racing. Anyway here it is:

    1: allowing cars to turn up looking like battered dogshit does nothing to attract new folks and everything to deter them. Wrap costs about half a set of tires and is fairly easy to do, I know a girl who’d be happy to show you. Some time needs to be spent here making sure one or two cars aren’t negatively effecting growth in the group.

    2: Tires
    A: races are won in the shop and lost on the track. There’s a few that are complaining about tires being the woe of their racing aspirations but not spending much time learning how to make their car handle better such that whenever they hit the track they have their best foot forward. The guys up front are spending (loads) of time doing this and frankly thinking simply dropping on a fresh set of RRs fixes everything is pretty naive. On the flip side if you are interested I’d be glad to help in this area, as would most of the fast folks of CMC.

    B: randomly changing tires, forsaking contingencies, with no solid data outside forum rants is simply shifting the problem and akin to kicking a can down the road. The deal NASA has with TOYO benifits CMC, why on earth would the group want to find a reason to lose that? Present solid data to NASA and TOYO to improve the tire and do more of point A

    3: we all need to do more on social media to promote both classes. Daniel has been doing a great job at this lately. Remember, most of us joined because of the year end videos, yet we do nothing to compel folks that are good at pulling that together to want to spend dozens of hours doing it. We need to actively discuss how we intend to grow both groups through these areas.

    These are the key issues from my perspective. And go

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Trublu View Post

    3: we all need to do more on social media to promote both classes. Daniel has been doing a great job at this lately. Remember, most of us joined because of the year end videos, yet we do nothing to compel folks that are good at pulling that together to want to spend dozens of hours doing it. We need to actively discuss how we intend to grow both groups through these areas.

    These are the key issues from my perspective. And go
    Agree on all points especially #3. We are averaging 500+ views on each post which I think is pretty neat and good reach. As I said after cresson I'm willing to do the video editing for our group, but it would be narcissistic of me to only post videos of myself...I'd love to be able to do a weekend recap with videos from a couple cars to try and capture some of the hard racing. I have some other ideas that I've spoken to a few of you about that I hope to launch on the social media platforms that should help at least explain the series and maybe motivate more folks to join us.
    Daniel Records
    CMC # 34

  4. #34
    Senior Member Grass-Passer Suck fumes's Avatar
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    I honestly think the TMS race was scheduled as an experiment to see what the turnout would be. If it’s good I would bet TMS would be COTA’s replacement for next year. If scca can charge $700 for a COTA entry fee than why can’t NASA??

    If COTA is on the schedule next yr I may skip it and do TMS if the entry is still $1200.

    Having run TMS for years with SCCA in spec miata I will tell you it is not a track to take lightly. My dad has hit the wall there before and the “soft barriers” aren’t exactly soft haha. My point is just make sure your brakes are in great shape before you run there and check over everything. You will prob see your cars top speed there aero limited of course. The TMS garages though are awesome and don't cost that much.

    The scca TMS entry fees were typically $75-$100 more than the avg entry fee.
    Last edited by Suck fumes; 05-07-2019 at 09:42 PM.
    “A man with no enemies is a man with no character.”
    ― Paul Newman

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Trublu View Post
    Some time needs to be spent here making sure one or two cars aren’t negatively effecting growth in the group.
    yeah yeah, it's on my list lol

    - Josh
    CMC #50

  6. #36
    Senior Member Grass-Passer
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    I know it's been said but don't let COTA reg bring you down, it's over priced, the people vote with their wallets. I don't think CMC is dying, just an overpriced event.

    CMC was much more expensive than I anticipated, I had 10k more into my CMC car than my Spec Miata AND I built the motor/trans/rear everything in the mustang.
    SM I purchased the pro built motor/trans/rear and it was still much cheaper. Some of the things keeping the costs down in SM are, tires, low weight so easier on tires/brakes, have to run stock brakes, 125hp, fuel etc.

    I could careless the HP or lap times, it's all about the racing IMO, CMC at 150hp, 200, 500, etc, just about the same fun factor with huge cost differences.

    Parts are getting hard to find, esp for LT1, foxes, I ran into this many times with the CMC car, I would buy a new part, it was from China and shit. Everything I got for the car I would check myself to confirm it was in spec or worth a damn if possible. Ex: Brand new FRPP Damper, the rubber damper between the inside and outside wasn't installed correctly and would have failed, etc.
    Tyler Gardner
    CMC #13 2015-2017
    SM #013 2018
    www.dfwmustangs.net

  7. #37
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby ShadowBolt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trublu View Post

    2: Tires
    A: races are won in the shop and lost on the track. There’s a few that are complaining about tires being the woe of their racing aspirations but not spending much time learning how to make their car handle better such that whenever they hit the track they have their best foot forward. The guys up front are spending (loads) of time doing this and frankly thinking simply dropping on a fresh set of RRs fixes everything is pretty naive. On the flip side if you are interested I’d be glad to help in this area, as would most of the fast folks of CMC.

    B: randomly changing tires, forsaking contingencies, with no solid data outside forum rants is simply shifting the problem and akin to kicking a can down the road. The deal NASA has with TOYO benifits CMC, why on earth would the group want to find a reason to lose that? Present solid data to NASA and TOYO to improve the tire and do more of point A
    I have not heard a single person say they think all they need to do to be fast is purchase a new set of RR's every event but even if having new tires did not make you any faster when the guys at the front are showing up with a new set of $1200.00 tires at every event the other slower drivers (and possible new drivers) will look at that as part of the cost of racing.

    I do not believe that NASA or Toyo cares about the RR heat cycle issue.

    I know for sure that BL and I (and other mid pack slackers that are wanting a less expensive tire) do not spend near the time on the car that it takes to run upfront. I know we don't do DE's to get seat time. Getting a tire that does not heat cycle out is not going to put drivers like us at the front and we know that but it could save thousands of dollars per season and maybe get the cost down to attract new racers.

    Jerry

  8. #38
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trublu View Post
    Been watching these threads over the past few months but have shied away from offering my opinion (imagine that). I loved CMC and only went to AI as I liked the development aspect, what I knew I’d miss was big fields and close racing. Anyway here it is:

    1: allowing cars to turn up looking like battered dogshit does nothing to attract new folks and everything to deter them. Wrap costs about half a set of tires and is fairly easy to do, I know a girl who’d be happy to show you. Some time needs to be spent here making sure one or two cars aren’t negatively effecting growth in the group.

    2: Tires
    A: races are won in the shop and lost on the track. There’s a few that are complaining about tires being the woe of their racing aspirations but not spending much time learning how to make their car handle better such that whenever they hit the track they have their best foot forward. The guys up front are spending (loads) of time doing this and frankly thinking simply dropping on a fresh set of RRs fixes everything is pretty naive. On the flip side if you are interested I’d be glad to help in this area, as would most of the fast folks of CMC.

    B: randomly changing tires, forsaking contingencies, with no solid data outside forum rants is simply shifting the problem and akin to kicking a can down the road. The deal NASA has with TOYO benifits CMC, why on earth would the group want to find a reason to lose that? Present solid data to NASA and TOYO to improve the tire and do more of point A

    3: we all need to do more on social media to promote both classes. Daniel has been doing a great job at this lately. Remember, most of us joined because of the year end videos, yet we do nothing to compel folks that are good at pulling that together to want to spend dozens of hours doing it. We need to actively discuss how we intend to grow both groups through these areas.

    These are the key issues from my perspective. And go
    Good discussion and point bye taken on #1.

    #2. I think some are missing a point about the tires. NOBODY thinks that changing tires is going to change where anyone finishes. I have felt like some think if we switch tires that it would help where I personally finish which I think is a load of crap. My bet is that the gap between the trophy girls would be larger for me. This is about finding a tire that lasts longer and is cheaper. I spoke with a former racer last night and when some people started showing up in CMC with a new set of tires every event they decided this wasn't the class for them. I know of others who stopped racing in large part due to the tires so if we have a current racer impacted by it then it's fair to say it could impact a prospective racer. (look again at what TT is doing to change this on their own and seeing people come back to their class)
    Again-I don't believe for a second that a different brand of tires is going to help where I finish. This seems to the majority wanting to lower the season tire budget while only a few want to keep the status quo.

    B. I disagree that NASA's deal with CMC benefits the group as a whole. I have run the numbers on sets of tires purchased by the collective group for a season and even with contingencies we would come out a whole lot better on something like a Falken. Sure the contingency benefits the podium finishers-but my bet is that the gap between the good drivers and hacks like me will be greater on a less grippier tire.

    3. Great point on social media which I'm not on.
    Bryan Leinart
    CMC #24

  9. #39
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby
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    Quote Originally Posted by mach1 View Post
    I know it's been said but don't let COTA reg bring you down, it's over priced, the people vote with their wallets. I don't think CMC is dying, just an overpriced event.
    Agreed! People vote with their wallets to race or go do something else for fun like a boat, jeep/motorcycles etc (I know of four specifically who chose those exact examples over racing). We can also vote with our wallets on tires and fun run or class in AIX.
    Bryan Leinart
    CMC #24

  10. #40
    Senior Member Carroll Shelby RichardP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BryanL View Post
    What class did spec vette run in? Curious what their lap times were and if anyone talked to them about their tires or how they held up at Cota? Were any races longer did they fall off during the race?
    Some tire information from one of the Spec Corvette drivers:

    Quote Originally Posted by Olitho
    No, they are running a 200 tread wear street tire from Falken, the 615K+. We slip and slide a lot on those tires, but that adds to the fun. Spec Corvette racers, like many of the other products we use, get the tires for nearly 50% discount. The best part is that they don't heat cycle out. I won the third race on Sunday on tires I drove on for three 30 minute sessions and one 20 minute session at COTA on Friday, I then qualified three times and did three 30 minute races over Saturday on Sunday with the same tires... wait a minute, that is not the best part. The best part is that I did four races on those same tires over a month earlier at CVR and then another Saturday of racing on them in Spec Corvette at WSIR. I have at least one more weekend on those tires and they are still capable of winning. Last year I drove to WSIR, raced and drove home in my Spec Corvette. Another weekend I raced NASA ST2 in the rain, won, drove the car to the awards ceremony at a restaurant offsite and then back to my motorhome at the track.

    "Capable of winning" is maybe not the same as "no drop off in performance" depending on the competitiveness of the class but this is still good information. He has raced a bunch in classes other than Spec Corvette so he knows the tires heat cycling out game well...


    Richard P.

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