2020 Season Opener - MSR-H **Time to Sign-Up**

[marshall_mosty]

So due and annual tech, $40 total?

How's the AICMC piggy bank looking these days?

- Josh

$10 annual tech (for the sticker... goes to NASA TX)
$30 dues (goes to the AI/CMC piggy bank)

Piggy bank is currently $712 in the hole, but there is approx. $325 in annual costs for 2020 (web hosting, Hallett trophies, and the plaques for the traveling trophies) baked into that which I haven't spent yet, but will. If everyone pays just their 2020 dues from the list above we will be down to $412 in the red. If folks pay their "past due" bills, we would be barely in the black for 2020 year end so then anyone else's dues after MSR-H would go to Hallett food and year end banquet prep.

[drecords]

There’s a couple of mustangs in DE this weekend. One is #508 and is a coworker and I’m pretty sure his car is close to a CMC setup new edge. Another one is #94 Kishnan and will be in a silver New Edge. We need to see if those guys will go for a ride with one of you that have a passenger seat.

I just signed up!

[Sook]

Is there a parking plan for the weekend? Anyone running T&T?

- Josh

[Al Fernandez]

I'm still paying off the $240 or so I was owed from the 2010 season...

[Trublu]

What’s our plan for watching/checking in on Daytona 24?

[ShadowBolt]

Well guys I'm sorry to say this but I'm out for this weekend. After losing the engine due to fuel wash last season starting at Cresson and ending at Hallett I had the lower end rebuilt and the heads cleaned up. I had sent the 21 lb. injectors to Houston to get them cleaned and they said two were stuck open but they were good to go after they cleaned them. When I started the engine for the first time it had two dead holes. I did a compression and everything was good. I changed the plugs and coil packs but still had two dead holes. Turned out to be two of the injectors were not firing. I installed two old 19 lb'ers in the place of the two dead 21's and it ran smooth. So I purchased a new set of 24 lb. injectors. 19 lb. injectors are at 85% duty cycle at 258 hp and so I did not want that and there are no 21 lb. injectors available new (just more used E-bay crap). I went to the dyno on Monday and made 202 hp at 10:1. I had a guy send me a tune that was set for 24 lb. injectors even though I know I can't run it just to see if that was the issue (there are all kinds of thoughts on this if you can or can't run 24's without adjusting the computer but Ford says the computer can compensate for up to a 30% difference on a stock tune after driving for a ways). After installing a tune for the 24 lb. injectors I went back to the dyno yesterday in the rain and 40 degree weather just to pull another 202 hp this time at 11:1 fuel ratio. Not only that but as soon as we got a little heat in the engine (still way below thermostat opening) the car would die right after starting. It died two times when he started it up to drive it on the rollers and two more times when he tried to start it to do the pull. I was told something else is wrong because even if I had a way to change the ratio from 11:1 to 12.5:1 I would not gain 50 hp (I was told maybe 15). So whatever took the engine out last year is still wrong and it's not the injectors as I had assumed. I have to find someone (hopefully in the Central Texas area) that can data-log the car and help me figure this out. I have too much money in the engine to mess it up again. I'm at my wits end! You guys have fun and maybe I will see you at Cresson. I'm just sick about it as I was looking forward to hanging out with you guys and racing this weekend.

JJ

[BryanL]

Who knows what kind of tuning software is best to diagnose problems for the 4.6 Ford? I have talked to Jerry a lot about his issues and believe if a knowledgeable tuner or repair shop could look at all the parameters with something like HP Tuners then there is a chance that they find something way out of wack that would point to a sensor/wiring/computer etc. I'm not talking about needing any sort of tune but something the computer is seeing must be making it so rich and probably pulling all the timing out at the same time.
I know of True Street in Mckinney up here that does a lot of tuning and I think would be a place he should drop it off but there has to be someone closer who can plug into the OBD and see what the computer is seeing and doing.

[drecords]

Well guys I'm sorry to say this but I'm out for this weekend. After losing the engine due to fuel wash last season starting at Cresson and ending at Hallett I had the lower end rebuilt and the heads cleaned up. I had sent the 21 lb. injectors to Houston to get them cleaned and they said two were stuck open but they were good to go after they cleaned them. When I started the engine for the first time it had two dead holes. I did a compression and everything was good. I changed the plugs and coil packs but still had two dead holes. Turned out to be two of the injectors were not firing. I installed two old 19 lb'ers in the place of the two dead 21's and it ran smooth. So I purchased a new set of 24 lb. injectors. 19 lb. injectors are at 85% duty cycle at 258 hp and so I did not want that and there are no 21 lb. injectors available new (just more used E-bay crap). I went to the dyno on Monday and made 202 hp at 10:1. I had a guy send me a tune that was set for 24 lb. injectors even though I know I can't run it just to see if that was the issue (there are all kinds of thoughts on this if you can or can't run 24's without adjusting the computer but Ford says the computer can compensate for up to a 30% difference on a stock tune after driving for a ways). After installing a tune for the 24 lb. injectors I went back to the dyno yesterday in the rain and 40 degree weather just to pull another 202 hp this time at 11:1 fuel ratio. Not only that but as soon as we got a little heat in the engine (still way below thermostat opening) the car would die right after starting. It died two times when he started it up to drive it on the rollers and two more times when he tried to start it to do the pull. I was told something else is wrong because even if I had a way to change the ratio from 11:1 to 12.5:1 I would not gain 50 hp (I was told maybe 15). So whatever took the engine out last year is still wrong and it's not the injectors as I had assumed. I have to find someone (hopefully in the Central Texas area) that can data-log the car and help me figure this out. I have too much money in the engine to mess it up again. I'm at my wits end! You guys have fun and maybe I will see you at Cresson. I'm just sick about it as I was looking forward to hanging out with you guys and racing this weekend.

JJ

Jerry give Chris Car Doc in Humble a call. He’s pretty knowledgeable and might at least point you in the right direction or might be worth bringing your car to him.

[Sook]

Well guys I'm sorry to say this but I'm out for this weekend. After losing the engine due to fuel wash last season starting at Cresson and ending at Hallett I had the lower end rebuilt and the heads cleaned up. I had sent the 21 lb. injectors to Houston to get them cleaned and they said two were stuck open but they were good to go after they cleaned them. When I started the engine for the first time it had two dead holes. I did a compression and everything was good. I changed the plugs and coil packs but still had two dead holes. Turned out to be two of the injectors were not firing. I installed two old 19 lb'ers in the place of the two dead 21's and it ran smooth. So I purchased a new set of 24 lb. injectors. 19 lb. injectors are at 85% duty cycle at 258 hp and so I did not want that and there are no 21 lb. injectors available new (just more used E-bay crap). I went to the dyno on Monday and made 202 hp at 10:1. I had a guy send me a tune that was set for 24 lb. injectors even though I know I can't run it just to see if that was the issue (there are all kinds of thoughts on this if you can or can't run 24's without adjusting the computer but Ford says the computer can compensate for up to a 30% difference on a stock tune after driving for a ways). After installing a tune for the 24 lb. injectors I went back to the dyno yesterday in the rain and 40 degree weather just to pull another 202 hp this time at 11:1 fuel ratio. Not only that but as soon as we got a little heat in the engine (still way below thermostat opening) the car would die right after starting. It died two times when he started it up to drive it on the rollers and two more times when he tried to start it to do the pull. I was told something else is wrong because even if I had a way to change the ratio from 11:1 to 12.5:1 I would not gain 50 hp (I was told maybe 15). So whatever took the engine out last year is still wrong and it's not the injectors as I had assumed. I have to find someone (hopefully in the Central Texas area) that can data-log the car and help me figure this out. I have too much money in the engine to mess it up again. I'm at my wits end! You guys have fun and maybe I will see you at Cresson. I'm just sick about it as I was looking forward to hanging out with you guys and racing this weekend.

JJ

I agree that correcting the O2 ratios isn't going to pickup 50 hp. The O2s aren't very far off of what they should be, especially considering the car doesn't have any learned corrections from driving around in traffic with a non-stock set of injectors. That means that the computer is doing what it's supposed to do by adding the correct amount of fuel for the air it's getting. This sounds like an air restriction to me, I had a similar issue two years ago and couldn't figure it out for the life of me. After I gave up Craig Wiseman found a pound of rubber clogging my MAF and intake tube.

Looking at the fuel trims should give you an indication as well. If the fuel is pulled way back (negative), you're not getting as much air as you should be. If they're very positive, you've got a fueling issue (injectors, pressure, flow, etc). A little negative, maybe -2ish, is common at idle on modern engines.

- Josh

Could it be that the timing isn't advancing properly?

[Supercharged111]

Well guys I'm sorry to say this but I'm out for this weekend. After losing the engine due to fuel wash last season starting at Cresson and ending at Hallett I had the lower end rebuilt and the heads cleaned up. I had sent the 21 lb. injectors to Houston to get them cleaned and they said two were stuck open but they were good to go after they cleaned them. When I started the engine for the first time it had two dead holes. I did a compression and everything was good. I changed the plugs and coil packs but still had two dead holes. Turned out to be two of the injectors were not firing. I installed two old 19 lb'ers in the place of the two dead 21's and it ran smooth. So I purchased a new set of 24 lb. injectors. 19 lb. injectors are at 85% duty cycle at 258 hp and so I did not want that and there are no 21 lb. injectors available new (just more used E-bay crap). I went to the dyno on Monday and made 202 hp at 10:1. I had a guy send me a tune that was set for 24 lb. injectors even though I know I can't run it just to see if that was the issue (there are all kinds of thoughts on this if you can or can't run 24's without adjusting the computer but Ford says the computer can compensate for up to a 30% difference on a stock tune after driving for a ways). After installing a tune for the 24 lb. injectors I went back to the dyno yesterday in the rain and 40 degree weather just to pull another 202 hp this time at 11:1 fuel ratio. Not only that but as soon as we got a little heat in the engine (still way below thermostat opening) the car would die right after starting. It died two times when he started it up to drive it on the rollers and two more times when he tried to start it to do the pull. I was told something else is wrong because even if I had a way to change the ratio from 11:1 to 12.5:1 I would not gain 50 hp (I was told maybe 15). So whatever took the engine out last year is still wrong and it's not the injectors as I had assumed. I have to find someone (hopefully in the Central Texas area) that can data-log the car and help me figure this out. I have too much money in the engine to mess it up again. I'm at my wits end! You guys have fun and maybe I will see you at Cresson. I'm just sick about it as I was looking forward to hanging out with you guys and racing this weekend.

JJ

MAF will skew fuel and timing together. I'd start there.