Texas Mustang Challenge Review 2016/2015

[ShadowBolt]

So... all very interesting reading and I appreciate everyone voicing their thoughts. Last time we changed CMC rules about platform parity was for the 2013 season. We took track width away (0.75") from the GM camp and added weight (50lbs) to the GMs as well. I hated adding weight to the GM cars over taking weight off of the Mustangs but back then many GM drivers couldn't make minimum weight so it made things better.

The discussions then were almost exactly like the discussions in this and the other thread...except the platforms were swapped. At the time we did what I consider to be a fair job of trying to use data to help including lap times, number of wins, number of fastest laps, and even theoretical best laps using data loggers. We rationalized needing to make changes, and we did.

Four racing seasons later, we certainly don't have Camaro Camaro Challenge as many in 2011 said we were headed to. Instead, in Texas, we've had a ford win the series four years in a row, and have plenty of fast cars running foxes, SN95s, SN99s, as well as GMs. I'd say the rules changes worked. Perhaps they worked too well, perhaps not and that is why I purposely started encouraging discussion about platform parity that have essentially been dormant for a long time. The reality is we've never made an attempt to reconcile if we had gone too far, not far enough, or hit the target square in the bullseye. As I explained to the rest of the directors, I'm not in a particular hurry to make a change, but I do want to continue discussion and spend time gathering data and analyzing it to see if a change is warranted.

Al, you are welcome to use my Trackmate to put in different cars to see where we are. Real data is the only thing that counts. Numbers of wins and poles is BS. Track width should be as close as possible IMHO. Why should anyone get extra width? We may have gone too far in weight but I don't know. I do think that if the Mustang was the same weight as the fourth gen the race results would be exactly the same. Performance would be different but I don't see it changing the results......maybe I'm wrong. I know BL is sure I'm wrong. I'm not sure the Fox needs to weigh any less than a SN95 or SN99 but most are way over the min. anyway. Please add 200 lbs. to Tyler and Craig's cars and I will be winning every race........yeah...BS. Okay back to the real world. If the data shows that we should all weigh the same thing no problem.
I know I talked to Derek Wright and he told me point blank that the Camaro was a better race car and he felt he had an advantage. In fact he ask me why I was driving a Mustang. We also have to remember that Mr. Curtis kind of won everything at Hallett two years ago in a fourth gen. I think we are very close guys and talking about wins and poles is not the answer. Lets get some data and if adjustments need to be made so be it. I know guys over 58 should get an extra 50 HP and TQ!


JJ

[blk96gt]

As far as weight goes, up until this weekend I always came across the scales at a minimum of 3260 (usually closer to 3280). This last weekend I came in at 3196.

[Fbody383]

We also have to remember that Mr. Curtis kind of won everything at Hallett two years ago in a fourth gen. I think we are very close guys and talking about wins and poles is not the answer.

Hallett 2014
R1 Rahjes/Jordan/Mosty/Curtis
R2 McCormick/Mosty/Francis/Rahjes
R3 Crumpacker/Jordan/Curtis/Mozader
R4 Curtis/Mosty/Rahjes/Francis/Fernandez - I'm pretty sure this was the mixed RA1/RR year.

[mach1]

How do they deal with platform parity in pro racing, IE World Challenge, etc? So if someone puts tons of effort into improving grip on their car, they will potentially get penalized after comparing data. Also, the driver really needs to be taken out of the equation on the platform discussion.

[mach1]

Hallett 2014
R1 Rajes/Jordan/Mosty/Curtis
R2 McCormick/Mosty/Francis/Rajes
R3 Crumpacker/Jordan/Curtis/Mozader
R4 Curtis/Mosty/Rajes/Francis/Fernandez - I'm pretty sure this was the mixed RA1/RR year.

What about qual?

[Fbody383]

What about qual?

"Data not available" Ok, I made that up, but it's not given at the timingscoring.drivenasa.com site.

[Fbody383]

I scanned through the 201/2014/2015 results. Without knowing the cars' tire condition it feels (i.e. I don't have all the lap data, positions gained/loss, racing related issues, etc.) like it's slight mustang advantage that gets magnified at TWS, perhaps that's the weight break affecting accel/decal?

Oh, and you guys should just let me have R2 at Hallett.

[Supercharged111]

What about qual?

If you really want to get picky, there are people like me who tend to run faster on Sunday than they do on Saturday.

[mach1]

If you really want to get picky, there are people like me who tend to run faster on Sunday than they do on Saturday.

Well in that case, give the Camaro .75" more track on Saturday only

For what it's worth to the group, I have been focusing on my driving the past few years, my car is far from ideal, my driving still needs work too, but for 2017 I am going to step it up on car setup.
I spend time looking at data(not as much as I should though), watching others make fast laps on youtube, looking at sat photos of the track, taking notes from each corner with a track map, worked with a professional driver on some coaching, meditating before the race and on grid, visualizing winning, making practice laps on grid in my head, studying excellence in sports and other areas (mostly NFL), etc etc etc...

[BryanL]

It's interesting to share the results and then hear the posturing. GM guys are basically saying hey-should we give this data any consideration as a reason to get data acquisition? Much different than the Mustang whining prior to 2013. Ford guys say the rules are good-shocker. Though it is shocking that Boudy thinks the rules should be reversed to see what happens with Dan. For those that weren't around he was pretty vocal about the Fox being at a disadvantage.

Now the posts between MFW/Richard are the most entertaining. Don't think you could get out of my car currently. I have had Patterson/McSpadden in my car but they haven't gone any faster then me-I think they sandbagged just to make me feel good and I appreciate it but they didn't magically run 4 seconds quicker. My car has Stoptechs, AST's, corner weight/alignment by Texas Track Works and is a good car that is certainly capable of being faster without me behind the wheel.