Wheels

[Hood]

Found this at RacingJunk.com. Thought maybe an AI Ford driver might want a spare set-o-wheels. Granted, they're 17x9's but a good price anyway. Could be good for those lapping session days.

http://www.racingjunk.com/category/1109/Road_Racing_Wheels/post/1523760/6-Enkei-Racing-Series-RPF1-17-x-9-5-bolt.html

[michaelmosty]

I'd buy these in a second if they were legal for CMC2. :shock: Especially since 17 x 9.5's are near impossible to find under $250 / wheel.
Any chance that 18 lb. weight rule will change?

[Hood]

Do like some of the left coasters do... have custom weight rings fabbed (cut 'em yourself) and bolt to the back of the wheels around the inside hub. You only need 2.1 lbs to make it.

[AI#97]

Do like some of the left coasters do... have custom weight rings fabbed (cut 'em yourself) and bolt to the back of the wheels around the inside hub. You only need 2.1 lbs to make it.

yeah, more left coast rule "bending".... LOL!!! Apparently, things WE in TX consider "stretching" the rules has been the norm for years in Kali....

Oh well, CMC2'ers....order up the enkei's and buy some "spacers"!!!

[GlennCMC70]

i would consider it legal if the spacers were welded to the wheels, otherwise, not a chance.

[AI#97]

i would consider it legal if the spacers were welded to the wheels, otherwise, not a chance.

It would have to be in steel to get enough weight, would you accept an interference fit with it pressed on...? Sort of hard to weld tungsten or steel to aluminum! LOL!!! :wink:

[ShadowBolt]

epoxy should be as good as welding.

[Wirtz]

i would consider it legal if the spacers were welded to the wheels, otherwise, not a chance.

Why, what's the difference if it is there and is reasonably attached (so as to not be considered a safety issue)? Think like a CCW with the bizzallion bolts threadlocked or wire locked....

[GlennCMC70]

if its not attached (part of the wheel) it will be too hard to police. who's wheels have spacers required to meet minimum weight? who's doesnt?
as for the CCW's and being bolted, its not likely someone will remove the the center or one of the wheel halves and run the car that way.

if its fixed to the wheel, then there is no interpretational issues.
not sure how you would bolt it, but i dont like it.
not going to allow the JB weld thing.
so, my answer, weld them on. how? dont care. your problem as you picked the wheels that created the problem, so figure out how to make it work.

[Jeremy Gunter]

so, my answer, weld them on. how? dont care. your problem as you picked the wheels that created the problem, so figure out how to make it work.

From a rookies point of view, How about you and the directors find us both (Camaros and mustangs) a comparable spec of wheel so we don't have to figure out a way to make it work... It's what the series is based on... right?

[Hood]

Wow... I was only posting this for the AI crowd. Didn't mean to upset da man!

[GlennCMC70]

so, my answer, weld them on. how? dont care. your problem as you picked the wheels that created the problem, so figure out how to make it work.

From a rookies point of view, How about you and the directors find us both (Camaros and mustangs) a comparable spec of wheel so we don't have to figure out a way to make it work... It's what the series is based on... right?

want me to drive it for ya to?

[mitchntx]

Any one recall Hallett last year?

I see Glenn is getting his game face on ...

[Adam Ginsberg]

From a rookies point of view, How about you and the directors find us both (Camaros and mustangs) a comparable spec of wheel so we don't have to figure out a way to make it work... It's what the series is based on... right?

Sorry Jeremy, but it's not the responsibility of the directors to find parts for competitors.

Several years ago, when I was looking to put a new set of rims on my car, I did a great deal of research, trying to find that "perfect rim" - strong, lightweight, correct dimensions (dia/width/offset/bolt pattern/etc), reasonable cost, readily available. IIRC, Lewis and I found the MB's at about the same time....but I didn't expect any of the other directors to find them for me/us.

Besides, that's half the fun of racing....trying to find that hidden, legal "advantage" no one has figured out yet. Or you hope no one has figured it out yet. ;)

Gary - who on the left coast in CMC2 is using these rims?? So far, I haven't seen any, but then, I haven't raced in NorCal since last year.

I think Glenn is off his meds again..... :lol:

[Fbody383]

so, my answer, weld them on. how? dont care. your problem as you picked the wheels that created the problem, so figure out how to make it work.

From a rookies point of view, How about you and the directors find us both (Camaros and mustangs) a comparable spec of wheel so we don't have to figure out a way to make it work... It's what the series is based on... right?

cmc2 rookies...

Mr. Da Man, if you do drive the mustang let me know... I know to watch for that superfast 70 car... Kachow!

So, what did I miss last year?

rookies.

[jeffburch]

Sorry Jeremy, but it's not the responsibility of the directors to find parts for competitors.


Hmmmm, I'm not quite sure this is accurate (from a 3rdGen owner's POV).

Movement of us to CMC2 is greatly contingent on parts selection/approval to which there has been little/no info released lately.

305 TPI???
350 TPI???
350 carb???

:arrow: :roll:
jb

[mitchntx]

Sorry Jeremy, but it's not the responsibility of the directors to find parts for competitors.


Hmmmm, I'm not quite sure this is accurate (from a 3rdGen owner's POV).

Movement of us to CMC2 is greatly contingent on parts selection/approval to which there has been little/no info released lately.

305 TPI???
350 TPI???
350 carb???

:arrow: :roll:
jb

I thought the same thing, JB.

The only thing I find consistent in the CMC world is inconsistency ...

[mitchntx]

So, what did I miss last year?

rookies.

hmmm ... how can I describe it ...

How about a cross between Lee Ermey the drill sargeant in Full Metal Jacket and Al Pacino in Scarface.

[Al Fernandez]

You're both right...and you're both wrong.
This is not a spec class. If it were, we would specify what wheels to run and everyone would run those wheels. Since it is not that way, we specify criteria the wheels need to meet. It is up to the individual competitor to determine their options, and make their own decision based on their particular balance of the competing priorities/goals (cost, weight, durability, performance, looks, replacement availability...) There are plenty of wheels which work just fine. They just might not be exactly what you as an individual would prefer.

The issue with the 3rd gens is not the same as questions around wheels.
The 3rd genners have a legitimate beef in that the engine rules are more experiment than anything else. As requested by NASA, we took our best shot. What this requires is testing, and unfortunately there just hasnt been enough testing to enable us to either prove the package is competitive or to be able to move the rules towards a more competitive combination.

That I know of there is one CMC2 spec 305 and another with a 350, both on the west coast. Early indications from the 350 arent good. The dyno pulls on the 305 show less horsepower than a cmc1 speck 305 so something is wrong in that motor. More testing needed, not enough volunteers to move this along at the rate we'd all like to see.

[Fbody383]

The 3rd genners (and Fox guys) have a legitimate beef in that the engine rules are more experiment than anything else. (U)nfortunately there just hasnt been enough testing to enable us to either prove the package is competitive or to be able to move the rules towards a more competitive combination.

Early indications from the 350 arent good. More testing needed, not enough others people money to move this along at the rate we'd all like to see.

Sorry Gary, we sure know how to drift a thread.

Al, how about an update thread on the motor development issues for both marques?

I'll go first... dayum rookies!

[AI#97]

Sorry Jeremy, but it's not the responsibility of the directors to find parts for competitors.

Several years ago, when I was looking to put a new set of rims on my car, I did a great deal of research, trying to find that "perfect rim" - strong, lightweight, correct dimensions (dia/width/offset/bolt pattern/etc), reasonable cost, readily available. IIRC, Lewis and I found the MB's at about the same time....but I didn't expect any of the other directors to find them for me/us.


Adam, this isn't a shot at you, but I got $10 that says the current wheel "spec" that Mustangs can't easily get to was likely written into the rules at a point in time when Tony G owned an f-body. :roll:

Personally, if you are using a spacer whether bolted, welded or static, it's rotating mass added outside the brake rotor and should be considered part of the wheel assembly. I would rather allow that than have racers come up with potentially unsafe solutions to attempt to take "advantage" of this rule "spec". Personally, I think the wheel weight rule needs to be deleted. It's stupid to require mustangs to go buy $550 custom 3pc wheels when a readily available wheel from enkei is out there for $250...

You say looking for those advantages is fun, however, spending money in a budget series where you shouldn't have to is frustrating.

[GlennCMC70]

the reason the spacer deal aint cutting it is cause i'm not keeping a running list of who's wheels meet spec weight w/ or w/out a spacer. if a racer shows up w/ a non-legal wheel, make it legal. that means add material. spacers are for spacing wheels, not making weight. if you weld it, its then part of the wheel.

if you dont understand that, i cant help you.

[BryanL]

Isn't there a rule about not allowing ballast rearward of the main hoop of the rollbar? So I don't think you could weld ballast onto the rear wheels :lol:

[Jeremy Gunter]

if you dont understand that, i cant help you.

I don't believe this is the attitude that got the series to where it is now, I do however believe it is the attitude that has gotten elevator guys their reputation over the years...

Hate to say it directors, but I think it's your job to help us. We don't set the rules, the group of directors sit down and talk about what we submit. We have no where to voice our opinions but here and at the track. Part of your duties are to make decisions on how the rules read, how they will be inforced, and what changes need to be made, correct?

Also, if a wheel spacer is attached to a wheel, with whatever form it may be attached, it would be safer (if it could withstand the heat) than the spacer's not attached to the wheel. Right? JB weld may/may not be able to withstand the heat, but having a pressure fitting on top of a cold/hot weld would only double the protection right?

As far as me wanting you to drive my car Glenn?
No Thanks...........

[mitchntx]

Rookies :roll:



I think it's your job to help us.


It's the director's job to make you THINK they are helping us, all the while raping the rule set to create turmoil and angst.

HTH ...

[AI#97]

I don't believe this is the attitude that got the series to where it is now, I do however believe it is the attitude that has gotten elevator guys their reputation over the years...

......

J, don't waste your time with Glenn, he's black or white kind of guy. Just keep running the snowflakes with the 255's. ;)

[Jeremy Gunter]

I don't believe this is the attitude that got the series to where it is now, I do however believe it is the attitude that has gotten elevator guys their reputation over the years...

......

J, don't waste your time with Glenn, he's black or white kind of guy. Just keep running the snowflakes with the 255's. ;)

I will till I can afford a set of $2500.00 rims or a new platform...

[GlennCMC70]

I don't believe this is the attitude that got the series to where it is now, I do however believe it is the attitude that has gotten elevator guys their reputation over the years...

......

J, don't waste your time with Glenn, he's black or white kind of guy. Just keep running the snowflakes with the 255's. ;)

untill its you who are responsible for the how the series is handled, you will never understand.

but hey, if your willing to police it and take the DQ if i catch it when you dont, have at it. my bet, thats not the case.

dont like my answer, call Tony G.

[GlennCMC70]

oh, and ballast is something that serves no other purpose than adding weight.
wheel spacers welded to wheels also change wheel offset.
no different than a cool suit cooler mounted in the rear of a car. yes it add's weight (no different than ballast) but thats not its purpose. its part of a driver comfort item, and therefore its not ballast.

[David Love AI27]

That I know of there is one CMC2 spec 305 and another with a 350, both on the west coast. Early indications from the 350 arent good. The dyno pulls on the 305 show less horsepower than a cmc1 speck 305 so something is wrong in that motor. More testing needed, not enough volunteers to move this along at the rate we'd all like to see.

My old 305 that was built to SCCA AS specs put out 292 hp and 311tq to the rear... I have offered to do ANY testing needed for the 3rd gen power plants... I have a completely stock 305 in an '85 sitting in my yard... I have a 350 4 bolt 250hp factory crate motor in my car now... I have a 305 short block out of a 85 blazer along with 3 sets of heads...

If a decision is made to to work on a carbed setup on a 3dr gen then give a set of specs from the directors and I will try it... I'm not in it for points or to go to nationals, I will run AIX with ANY motor just for testing...

[Hood]

Gary - who on the left coast in CMC2 is using these rims?? So far, I haven't seen any, but then, I haven't raced in NorCal since last year.


Some guy that beat you at the last race had some modded lightweight wheels (not the ones in the pics here) that are available through the Mazda people at Buttonwillow (but you didn't hear that from me). I thought is was extraordinarily creative.

[Al Fernandez]

Guys, put the pitch forks and the torches down, geez. Why does every discussion about anything in the rulebook turn into a mud sligning party?

Matt, I've said it before and I'll say it this last time: cut out the personal insults against Tony or any other official. I suggest you re-read section 23 of the NASA CCR before making the next similar comment. Tony hasnt raced had an f-body since late 2002 and ALL series officials were involved in writing the rule as it sits. You can keep your $10.

There are plenty of rules in CMC where one platform has an edge over another. You simply cannot take one individual rule and decide that it is not right. You have to take the entire rule set as a package. Is it easier for 4th gens to find and use 9.5" wheels? Yep. Is it easier for 4th gens to get to minimum weight? Nope. Just an example. The bottom line is every platform has their advantages and disadvantages. You pick your poison.

If you think that the rules should allow you to build one platform that maximizes each and every aspect of the book then you probably need to rethink your concept of platform parity.

I think the discussion around what constitues the weight of the wheel is a good one, especially since it hasn't come up before. I have no firm opinion yet. We know Glenn's: wheel weight is only to consider the permanent mass of the wheel (no balancing weights, no spacers). On the other end of the spectrum you could consider wheel weight to include balancing weights and spacers. That might be a very good way of looking at it, particularly from a 3rd gen perspective, though it is much more difficult to enforce.

I'm open to suggestions and will open a new thread for this. I think it does need definition. Once (if?) we reach agreement of what we'd like I'll take it to the other officials.

[AI#97]

Matt, I've said it before and I'll say it this last time: cut out the personal insults against Tony or any other official. I suggest you re-read section 23 of the NASA CCR before making the next similar comment.

Whatever dad...

I ain't going to apologize for anyting I have ever said about Tony. Be thankful I edited my response before I posted it. It was an inference and he's used to it by now.

[Alien]

On the other end of the spectrum you could consider wheel weight to include balancing weights and spacers. That might be a very good way of looking at it, particularly from a 3rd gen perspective, though it is much more difficult to enforce.

Glad you mentioned that! Never crossed my mind (I was just thinking of wee ~1/4" spacers). Looking at eventually going into CMC2, it's looking like 2" adapter and 4th gen wheels are one of the few viable options. With not counting those adapter (Hey Hood, can you weigh one of mine your borrowing for us?) that's another ding against the 3Gs.

*edit* Oops... forgot... rules now allow 3 piece wheels :roll: Maybe I'll sell a kidney and get some CCWs A-Sedan what?

[Rsmith350]

Any of you guys have one of these wheels that I can have/ buy?


http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m189/rsmith350/powdercoating%20stuff/101_0729.jpg



I need a rear wheel, just need one.


one of my set is bent :(

[AI#97]

Any of you guys have one of these wheels that I can have/ buy?


http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m189/rsmith350/powdercoating%20stuff/101_0729.jpg



I need a rear wheel, just need one.


one of my set is bent :(

I have seen hundreds on 3rd gens up on blocks all over Oklahoma for the last 6 weeks.... I really hate Oklahoma as of late.