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View Full Version : bit my tongue for some time now, till now.



GlennCMC70
06-22-2006, 01:16 AM
i gotta say i'm a little tired of the hush hush walking on eggshells crap.
#1 - if your leaving the series, tell the group. lets quit eluding to it and say who it is or not speak of it again. dayum, bunch of f'ing hens.
#2 - did a $50 bill and an official protest form get turned in to NASA for the issue w/ Adams car? if not, i see no reason for that persons name to be protected, or for that person to not step forward and admit they made the accusation.

oz98cobra
06-22-2006, 02:07 AM
regarding #2 - no it didn't - and I bet they don't have the balls to step forward! :roll:

The bigger issue here is what NASA TX officials chose to do with the "accusation". We can talk about it when it's resolved.

Mike Bell
06-22-2006, 05:27 AM
Glenn,

It was me. I wired the money to Tulsa. 8)

BTW, it's only $25, not $50.

CMC17
06-22-2006, 08:18 AM
This is much better than channel surfing.

mitchntx
06-22-2006, 08:22 AM
BTW, it's only $25, not $50.

Cheap ... I wonder if I can run a tab?

CMC17
06-22-2006, 08:31 AM
I put up the other half via MO.

Mike Bell
06-22-2006, 08:36 AM
You're only half a hen then. 8)

mitchntx
06-22-2006, 09:00 AM
Do you 2 guys do ANYTHING at work?

8)

Right now, I'm rendering video to author a DVD. Then it's busting off 50 copies ...

So, I have excuse ...

AllZWay
06-22-2006, 09:33 AM
i gotta say i'm a little tired of the hush hush walking on eggshells crap.


This must be the new and improved Glenn. You getting some new training at the cell company? :lol: :wink:

donovan
06-22-2006, 09:41 AM
The question I have is why was Jay so involved in the Tech of his car... I thought he was just a spectator/racer now???

I would like the answers as to what was going on, and why they were all over his car with flashlights and search dogs.

If someone thinks Adams car is not legal... or over HP... call him on it, protest it...

As for Tech looking at his car... they were searching for anything wrong with it... they looked everywhere and were hunting for anything, I overheard them asking about the MM R-LCA's, and at first they thought were not legal, but were soon corrected.

Mike Bell
06-22-2006, 09:50 AM
OK, AG's had a tough weekend and week but all kidding aside: I don't know who filed or if anyone filed and wasn't there but if someone filed a protest, there should have been a form and fee - period.

Given that, if someone filed then it stands to reason IMO that NASA TX would step up and do everything they could to ensure that AG's car was legal specifically because he's a Series Official.

Not because AG is a cheater, not because AG has won every race he's entered, but to do absolutely everything they can to remove any doubt of impropriety on the part of a NASA TX official in the series in which they compete and coordinate.

I have every confidence that AG's car will be found to be fully compliant and racing will resume as normal in August.

Search dogs sounds a bit over the top but, hey, whatever it takes! :)

AI#97
06-22-2006, 10:10 AM
Wow....this is going to be a long 6 weeks till TWS!!!

I have no stake in this specific mess but smoke usually equals fire. If the accusation is someone is cheating, then I would expect a fair and thorough and documented investigation to prove yes or no to the question.

As a competitor in this series I take extreme pride in racing as hard as I can within the rules set forth in the series so that I know without question that my performance has not been enhanced by breaking the rules and in fact if others are pushing the limits of the rules or breaking them, then I take EXTREME pride in the fact that I have outperformed them with a compliant car.

I think what we are all seeing is the NASA TX series has matured into a real race series where all the Crazy and Immature things that happen are starting to show up and become public.....Welcome to racing guys!

cmarvel
06-22-2006, 10:12 AM
I have worked in the tech shed and been an occasional cheif of tech for longer than some of our drivers have been alive. What was done to Adam's car was a witch hunt, and a fishing expedition.

Simply put, we as a group need to speak with one voice on this issue. We bring the largest group of competitors to every NASATX event, and we need to let everyone know that:

1) Protests and appeals will be be handled in STRICT accordance with the rules.
2) Anyone who participates in the process, particularly the officials MUST have in their posession and be familiar with the rules.
3) People who are not officials, and not DIRECTLY involved in the official action are not to participate in the process in ANY WAY.
4) WE WILL NOT TOLERATE individuals being singled out by officials for special treatment (good or bad). All cars must be subject to the same treatment.

Does anyone disagree with this?

Mike Bell
06-22-2006, 10:14 AM
Well said Chris, as always. I agree with you 100% but I must also add that since I was not in attendance I cannot say that these procedures were or were not followed.

donovan
06-22-2006, 10:22 AM
What was done to Adam's car was a witch hunt, and a fishing expedition.

4) WE WILL NOT TOLERATE individuals being singled out by officials for special treatment (good or bad). All cars must be subject to the same treatment.

Does anyone disagree with this?

That is my exact feelings, it was a witch hunt... with no explanation by the officials.

Chris, you and I feel the same way!!! All cars treated equal!!!

oz98cobra
06-22-2006, 10:40 AM
Indeed a very cowardly witch hunt, since they chose to do this conveniently at a time when Adam was unavoidably called away under sad circumstances.

Mr Bell and Mr White, if I went to a NASA TX official and said that a little bird told me that Bell's or White's car was illegal because of such and such, you would expect them to tell me to go file an official protest and pay the fee - and you certainly would expect them to follow the procedues laid down in the CCR and class rule books - which are in fact very clear on how officials should handle such cases, and how officials are to conduct themselves. You would expect to be treated with respect, and in good faith in any case!

I'm not going to go into all the details here just yet, but I will say this - as a racer in any series, I expect to be treated with respect, and in good faith by officials at all times, regardless of any circumstances. I have been racing various forms of motorsport on and off for over 25 year, and I have never seen such discusting behaviour from officials of a sanctioning body - not even close! It has me questioning why on earth I would want to spend good money to race with this organization.
:cry:

AI#97
06-22-2006, 10:48 AM
Daron, I totally agree....kind of like a search warrant. "hands off without paperwork MF'r!" Hence one of the reasons I chose AI as there is MUCH less chance of this. Spec series will always be subject to this kind of "witch hunt".

CM hit it on the head though because if they were conducting a "rotor rooter" of someone's CMC car, they best f'n know the CMC rules verbatim before crying wolf!


That being said...if they want to impound my car after a race, they are more than welcome to crawl their happy ass all over it and waste their time around a HOT race car. Unless I just totally missed something because I wasn't there this weekend, sounds like a bunch of Horseshit to me...?

mitchntx
06-22-2006, 10:53 AM
Simply put, we as a group need to speak with one voice on this issue. We bring the largest group of competitors to every NASATX event, and we need to let everyone know that:

1) Protests and appeals will be be handled in STRICT accordance with the rules.
2) Anyone who participates in the process, particularly the officials MUST have in their posession and be familiar with the rules.
3) People who are not officials, and not DIRECTLY involved in the official action are not to participate in the process in ANY WAY.
4) WE WILL NOT TOLERATE individuals being singled out by officials for special treatment (good or bad). All cars must be subject to the same treatment.

Does anyone disagree with this?

I would agree with that.

Having been on the recieving end of #4 at NPR last year and told it would happen once again at Hallett, I find this a refreshing discussion, knowing that the competitors who I was told were questioning my legality are in actuality surprised and appalled by this kind of segregation.

A witch hunt is very good description from all accounts.

Let me go on record right now and say that if any of you have an issue with my car, please, for God's sake, come talk to me about it.

I am guilty of NOT doing just that and am embarrassed by my lack of good judgement and trust. The end result was I learned something new, which is a good thing. Fom now on, when I think Corey's car has illegal wheel spikes and 30 caliber machine guns in the head lamps, I'll fill out the form and run a tab with NASA.

Mike ... don't feel bad. I was pitted right next to Darron and had no idea of what was going on on the other side of my trailer. Guess I need to get out more, huh?

Mike Bell
06-22-2006, 10:59 AM
Ok, apparently something outside the context of a normal protest has occurred. I was under the impression that a protest had been filed, my bad. I'm slower than most.

Can we talk about CR's 30 cals a bit more? I need to get my daily ration of the "spirit and intent" mantra. :D

mitchntx
06-22-2006, 11:08 AM
"spirit and intent" was flowing Fiday and Saturday night ....

http://www.aicmctexas.com/gallery/d/7341-1/Hallett_06_188.jpg

Mike Bell
06-22-2006, 11:12 AM
I like it Mitch,

AG and JB will be legalized shortly and we can get back to day-dreaming of the margarita machine running full blast after a hard day of racing.

GlennCMC70
06-22-2006, 01:32 PM
o.k. you guys got the point of my post. i also feel as though there could be a witch hunt. but i've also heard another side i will not pass on as i dont believe it.
Jay should not have been in the tech shed, period. even if Shannon asked him to. unless he is assigned an official title that allows him the need to be there, he's out of the loop and should be kept that way.
to give an example, he asked about a body contact form i was walking around w/ and i told him, "sorry, this is NASA TX buissiness."
yes, we should address this issue w/ NASA TX as Daron being held in tech after race 3 was not smart as this issue could have been addressed after race 4 and not have the time till next race be an issue w/ regards to safety.
is a racer @ anytime allowed to verify a protest form had been filed?

i too was told @ NPR that the checking of my restrictor was in my best intrest and not to think anything about it being sealed to the motor. @ this point and time, i know of no other example where a part as sealed to a motor for no other reason than to ensure its not changed. i wasnt asked to re-dyno after the event or anything. i also was told there were plans to do the same @ Hallett. this will not happen. i will allow it to be checked, but not sealed.

anyways, we all need to make this a topic @ the TWS meeting.
so w/ no evidence of a protest form, why is adam going to show up w/ his car for the dyno??
is this being pushed up the CMC national chain?

oz98cobra
06-22-2006, 01:44 PM
...
so w/ no evidence of a protest form, why is adam going to show up w/ his car for the dyno??
is this being pushed up the CMC national chain?

because he's not paying for it and he has nothing to be concerned about...

and yes it is.

cjlmlml
06-22-2006, 01:57 PM
Tongue was mispelled .

Glen , Please correct.

This is in the AICMCTEXAS.COM CCR's

jeffburch
06-22-2006, 02:15 PM
Carmack says the TWS event will never happen.

jb

Mike Bell
06-22-2006, 02:32 PM
Uh, that will be a big disappointment.

michaelmosty
06-22-2006, 02:42 PM
Carmack says the TWS event will never happen.

jb
??????
I'm confused :?

GlennCMC70
06-22-2006, 02:44 PM
sorry, i was in the middle of an 18 hour shift for the 2nd day straight. brains are just about gone.

CMC17
06-22-2006, 02:50 PM
Carmack says the TWS event will never happen.

jb

You can't leave us hanging like that!!! Do tell!!!!

AI#97
06-22-2006, 03:16 PM
Carmack says the TWS event will never happen.

jb

Was it the one armed man again?!

Quit teasing and spill the beans Juan Pablo! Or are you talking about the mid year meeting only?

jeffburch
06-22-2006, 03:21 PM
Carmack says the TWS event will never happen.

jb

You can't leave us hanging like that!!! Do tell!!!!

Uuh, Carmack is a fictitious character name for the clairvoyant side of my wit.
It's name comes from the old carmack character that Johnny Carson used to do on the Tonight Show. My crystal ball says that (TMS) event won't happen.
I may be reading it incorrectly as that has been the case before.
I'm looking for the Quigi board but have to wait til Bev gets home as I can't seem to find it.

jb

CMC17
06-22-2006, 04:04 PM
Carmack says the TWS event will never happen.

jb

You can't leave us hanging like that!!! Do tell!!!!

Uuh, Carmack is a fictitious character name for the clairvoyant side of my wit.
It's name comes from the old carmack character that Johnny Carson used to do on the Tonight Show. My crystal ball says that (TMS) event won't happen.
I may be reading it incorrectly as that has been the case before.
I'm looking for the Quigi board but have to wait til Bev gets home as I can't seem to find it.

jb


Understood now. I'm 180* out and on the opposite side of the globe. lol I remember the Carson show (re-runs on TV Land of course).

I need to go to wit school also... I'm lacking in that area. ;)

gt40
06-22-2006, 04:31 PM
Uuh, Carmack is a fictitious character name for the clairvoyant side of my wit.
It's name comes from the old carmack character that Johnny Carson used to do on the Tonight Show.Ooh! I thought you were talking about John Carmack -- founder of id software (Doom and Quake.) He is a car nut, and I though he might be getting into NASA.

Lewis Tanner
06-22-2006, 05:52 PM
http://www.jersooz.com/images/carnac.jpg
Jeff's new avatar?

Just to keep the "tech" straight, the character Carson played is Carnac the Magnificent. ;)

Boudy
06-22-2006, 06:25 PM
It's sad how the customers here are getting stale bread. The end all to a witch hunt would be for AI/CMC to just not show up at the next event.

Wanna carry a big stick or just whine!!! I do believe that the customers do have the final word.

Boudy

jeffburch
06-22-2006, 07:07 PM
http://www.jersooz.com/images/carnac.jpg
Jeff's new avatar?

Just to keep the "tech" straight, the character Carson played is Carnac the Magnificent. ;)

Ooohh Ooohh Ooohh........ YES!
You are CORRECT sir! (Ed M.)


No, keeping the oxcart.
Thanks Lewis.


jb

macstang
06-22-2006, 07:41 PM
An oxcart, I always wondered what that was.

jeffburch
06-22-2006, 08:14 PM
http://www.texicanracing.com/nasatx/JeffBurch/CMCoxcart.jpg

jb

AI#97
06-22-2006, 09:11 PM
It's sad how the customers here are getting stale bread. The end all to a witch hunt would be for AI/CMC to just not show up at the next event.

Wanna carry a big stick or just whine!!! I do believe that the customers do have the final word.

Boudy

You are all welcomed to it! I already had my no show so I have to be there if I am going to.....well, you know! :wink:

cmarvel
06-23-2006, 08:11 AM
I am not ready to advocate boycotting an event yet. That would be a poison pill for both NASA TX and AI-CMC-AIX, so I would consider that a last resort. What I do advocate is a meeting with NASA :!: OFFICIALS :!: about how we will ensure that this never happens again.

What is at stake here is the credability of the NASA TX organization.

cjlmlml
06-23-2006, 08:58 AM
TWS event will happen. Straight from Shannons mouth er email.

Witch hunt and other issues are being addressed.

If you have issues - Compose a simple, logical email & send to Adam and let him work on it.

AI#97
06-23-2006, 08:59 AM
I am not ready to advocate boycotting an event yet. That would be a poison pill for both NASA TX and AI-CMC-AIX, so I would consider that a last resort. What I do advocate is a meeting with NASA :!: OFFICIALS :!: about how we will ensure that this never happens again.

What is at stake here is the credability of the NASA TX organization.

Right on!

Let's setup up the venue of choice Friday night in CS in August. Friendly atmosphere, food, beer and notepads.....bring your CCR's.

Boudy
06-23-2006, 09:49 AM
Boycott, hopefully not, never. I mentioned this to enstill the stance that the racers as a group in this scenario need to speak/act as one. And yes, boycott would be a worst case action if all else fails.

I too am concerned with the actions and practices that lead to the credibility of NASA TX.

Boudy

CMC17
06-23-2006, 10:31 AM
Uuh, Carmack is a fictitious character name for the clairvoyant side of my wit.
It's name comes from the old carmack character that Johnny Carson used to do on the Tonight Show.Ooh! I thought you were talking about John Carmack -- founder of id software (Doom and Quake.) He is a car nut, and I though he might be getting into NASA.

LOL I thought the same thing John Carmack from id Software and the creater of Doom..etc. Different generation I guess. :lol:

jeffburch
06-23-2006, 10:38 AM
Uuh, Carmack is a fictitious character name for the clairvoyant side of my wit.
It's name comes from the old carmack character that Johnny Carson used to do on the Tonight Show.Ooh! I thought you were talking about John Carmack -- founder of id software (Doom and Quake.) He is a car nut, and I though he might be getting into NASA.

LOL I thought the same thing John Carmack from id Software and the creater of Doom..etc. Different generation I guess. :lol:
No, I'm a 3rd person shooter enthusiast as well. I have all of ID's games.
Remember Rendition and Voodoo chipsets?
Just one consinant off is all.
:wink:

jb

jeffburch
07-03-2006, 02:25 PM
Carmack says the TWS event will never happen.

jb

Carmack heard today that the rental fee (weekend/TWS)
is fifteen thousand dollars.

jb

GlennCMC70
07-03-2006, 03:26 PM
Lou rented it a few years back and it was only about half that w/ insurance. i cant see it doubling in cost over a couple years.
not saying your wrong, just not what i would believe w/out some more proof than hear say.

chicane23
07-03-2006, 04:23 PM
I believe he is probably correct. The track changed hands a few years ago and raised the cost. This per Rick at TDE.

I know last year it was 12K.

GlennCMC70
07-03-2006, 10:59 PM
yep, i was corrected once i talked w/ Mitch and he told me it was $6500 per day.
wow, alota coin for that track.

Lewis Tanner
07-03-2006, 11:28 PM
wow, alota coin for that track.

Well, it is really pleasant in July/August, right?