Nascar - Said or Smoke?

[Todd Covini]

Anyone see the incident between Boris Said & Tony Stewart today at Watkins Glen?

Who was at fault?
You be the judge.

-=- Todd

[jeffburch]

BS

jb

[AllZWay]

BOTH.... both could have avoided it and both chose not too.


Speaking of this incident... Has anyone been keeping up with the controversy in IRL?

The moron Brian Barnhart can't determine the differences between racing and blocking.

If the rules determining what is a safe pass or not for IRL can't be determined in a series that has been racing for 100 years... .I am not sure we could ever agree what constitutes a good pass versus an aggressive pass.

[evarner]

Smoke 100% at fault.

[Todd Covini]

I think Smoke ran out of room and said "oh no you don't".

[ShadowBolt]

I think Smoke ran out of room and said "oh no you don't".

The announcer said Boris had to leave Smoke racing room. Is that right?
JJ

[GlennCMC70]

Link to a vid? I didn't watch it cause I thought it was getting picked up by the DVR.

[GlennCMC70]

BS. Gotta leave some road to race on.

[evarner]

Nope..nope...nope.. Smoke went across the "defined" road course and lost all rights back onto it once he crossed the curbing. He entered without regard for the other drivers and caused the incident.

[GlennCMC70]

What rule book you reading? NASA CCR?
uh... that was a NASCAR issue.

[ShadowBolt]

Nope..nope...nope.. Smoke went across the "defined" road course and lost all rights back onto it once he crossed the curbing. He entered without regard for the other drivers and caused the incident.

I was just saying what the announcer said. Even if Said did have to leave Smoke room on the track Smoke moved a car and a half over when he came back on track.
Link to vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vj2yiwoWiNY

JJ

[AllZWay]

Nope..nope...nope.. Smoke went across the "defined" road course and lost all rights back onto it once he crossed the curbing. He entered without regard for the other drivers and caused the incident.

That is why I say both... Smoke could have let off and fell in behind Boris.... and Boris should have not left him no room to get back on track.

I don't really blame either...they played a game of chicken and BS lost.

[evarner]

Sorry if my 'nopes' seemed directed at any one person. More of an all- around generalization while thinking outloud with text. :D

I'm calling it as a spectator, making my last statement a personal choice based on visual queues witnessed through video media. To me, IMHO, it's something that could have been avoided, but in the end - Said didn't initiate the actual contact.

....moving on to solving global warming

[jeffburch]

No way.
BS on the inside failed to maintain his (talent) line.
8 corner better than 4 huh?
I think his curlers are too tight.
Don't tug on Superman's cape, and you don't mess around with Smoke.

jb

[AllZWay]

Don't tug on Superman's cape, and you don't mess around with Smoke.

jb

You gotta know who you are racing. :lol:

[evarner]

Too bad either of them weren't even close to leading at any point during the race. 8) Gotta do something in the back to make it interesting. :lol:

[HoustonNW]

Nope..nope...nope.. Smoke went across the "defined" road course and lost all rights back onto it once he crossed the curbing. He entered without regard for the other drivers and caused the incident.

That is why I say both... Smoke could have let off and fell in behind Boris.... and Boris should have not left him no room to get back on track.

I don't really blame either...they played a game of chicken and BS lost.

I just don't understand why if car A is even with car B at the apex, car A can run car B off the track. I see it in F1 all the time. It doesn't work quite as well if the cars have fenders, as Boris found out.

IMO you have to leave room. Maybe I'll learn otherwise as I get more W2W experience.

Boris admitted that he thought that he cleared Tony, although he didn't go so far as to admit fault.

[mitchntx]

I find it interesting the Burton/Johnson ran almost a shadow line to Stewart/Said and they didn't touch.

Said's spotter was clear enough saying that he was still there ... "barely" ...

But, Burton and everyone else was able to clip the corner and kick up dirt. All of a sudden Tony didn't think it was a good idea?

"I am going to hold my line" ... your line is a car and half outside the white line and a half a car behind the leading car.

Did Tony not watch Leffler on Saturday?

[HoustonNW]

I find it interesting the Burton/Johnson ran almost a shadow line to Stewart/Said and they didn't touch.

Said's spotter was clear enough saying that he was still there ... "barely" ...

But, Burton and everyone else was able to clip the corner and kick up dirt. All of a sudden Tony didn't think it was a good idea?

"I am going to hold my line" ... your line is a car and half outside the white line and a half a car behind the leading car.

Did Tony not watch Leffler on Saturday?

Not to argue, but I just finished watching the race. Do you think that Tony's line was out there or did Boris move him out there?

IMO, Boris moved him outside the rumble strips and didn't give him room to come back. Again IMO, Tony would have had at least two wheels, and maybe all four in the dirt. And I am not a Tony Stewart fan.

But I'm afraid that you're right and I picked the wrong hobby.

[Todd Covini]

This is a mock IRB guys, so we need to all come to one conclusion and agree on the decision.

Racing Incident?
Boris at fault?
Smoke at fault?

:D

-=- T

[mitchntx]

This is a mock IRB guys, so we need to all come to one conclusion and agree on the decision.

Racing Incident?
Boris at fault?
Smoke at fault?

:D

-=- T



27.3 Data Collection
The Chief of the IRB shall ensure that at least one (1) member from the IRB is in impound after each race, for all classes. IRB members that are present in impound shall ensure that all drivers involved in on-track incidences fill out a body contact report form. The IRB member(s) shall collect these forms, make notes as to the damage that they observed, question the parties involved, and make notes on the forms. These forms
shall be turned over to the Chief of the IRB for review. At the end of the day’s activities, the IRB shall meet, review each case, make the appropriate decisions, and turn over the findings and reports to the Race Director. Exact meeting times and places shall be determined the Chief of the IRB.

In order to convene a real IRB, I need to see the BCFs. I also need to look at the damage and interview the drivers and witnesses.

So you either have an agenda or looking for ammunition.

[AllZWay]

This is a mock IRB guys, so we need to all come to one conclusion and agree on the decision.

Racing Incident?
Boris at fault?
Smoke at fault?

:D

-=- T

I thought it was a good idea too..... no one can every agree on cause most of the time.

[Todd Covini]

Hey Mitch...27.3 occurred to a "T" in the last IRB, just in case there was some sarcasm there.

Regarding 27.3 for Watkins Glen....let's simulate the forms, and let the ESPN interviews be the only data available to you. C'mon...play along.

So how many for racing incident...for Boris....for Smoke?

-=- Todd

[mitchntx]

No sarcasm ...


25.6 Off-course Excursions
The competitor is required to follow the marked course during competition and shall not gain an advantage by an off-course excursion.

An off-course excursion is defined as leaving the marked course with all four wheels.

The definition of the term “advantage gained” will be left up to the sole discretion of the Race Director, and may include pass attempts that were completed, but the overtaking driver went four-wheels-off on the exit, and it was deemed to be an otherwise “ill-fated” pass (i.e. the “Zanardi maneuver”).

Penalties may be assessed for an off-course excursion that affords an advantage to the offender.

As long as we're in fantasy land, I'm the race director. NOT losing a position is an advantage.

Day before Leffler tried the same thing and created a "melee".

Burton and Johnson were folloing their tire tracks and didn't have contact.

Stewart: 2 race suspension, 2 weekend probation and has to work T7 at TWS next August.

[Fbody383]

So how many for racing incident...for Boris....for Smoke? ASSuming the rule for racing room is "find your own," Stewart at fault for contact.

He was behind, forced the issue, and turned Said.

Penalties
NFL rookie haricut
Wear a pink driving suit next 3 races
Bring the KL to MM at ECR

[David Love AI27]

This is a mock IRB guys, so we need to all come to one conclusion and agree on the decision.

Racing Incident?
Boris at fault?
Smoke at fault?

:D

-=- T

I didn't see the incident but you cannot compare NASCAR and NASA... NASCAR has told the divers to be more aggressive to bring back the fans... AND the drivers don't have to pay for the crap they damage...

[ShadowBolt]

This is a mock IRB guys, so we need to all come to one conclusion and agree on the decision.

Racing Incident?
Boris at fault?
Smoke at fault?

:D

-=- T

I didn't see the incident but you cannot compare NASCAR and NASA... NASCAR has told the divers to be more aggressive to bring back the fans... AND the drivers don't have to pay for the crap they damage...


Ding dind ding.......we have a winner!

JJ

[BryanL]

This is a mock IRB guys, so we need to all come to one conclusion and agree on the decision.

Racing Incident?
Boris at fault?
Smoke at fault?

:D

-=- T

I didn't see the incident but you cannot compare NASCAR and NASA... NASCAR has told the divers to be more aggressive to bring back the fans... AND the drivers don't have to pay for the crap they damage...


Ding dind ding.......we have a winner!

JJ

I believe the drivers meeting quote at the beginning of the year started with "Have at it boys!"

[gt40]

So how many for racing incident...for Boris....for Smoke? ASSuming the rule for racing room is "find your own," Stewart at fault for contact.Stewart at fault for running off track, turning Said, for moonlighting at Burger King (I wsaw it on TV, so it must be true,) and for being a prick in general.

Penalty -- two race suspension. Myst buy Said's gerew beer of their choice, must wash Said's entire race car post race in the hot pits for two races wearing a pink bra and panties. If said braw and panties are of the "granny-panty" variety, one race. Any more revealing and the penalty may be extended to 3 or more races.

[Crumpacker]

I think Robert is drunk.


Smoke at fault. 4 off the "racing surface" then puposely turned Said when he came back on. Should have breathed out of the throttle for .001sec and slotted in. It was fun to watch though.

[gt40]

I think Robert is drunk.I wish! Just bored at work.

[Al Fernandez]

Well hell I'll disagree to keep the discussion lively.

Boris is still attempting to complete a pass he initiated the prior turn. Does he have the right to force Smoke four off? Umm...no. How about the fact that his spotter kept advising him Smoke was there? How about the fact that that wall is coming up awful fast?? I think Boris just brain farted.

Boris at fault. Three points on the Shit List, DQ for the race and a probation for the rest of the weekend

[Crumpacker]

Nevermind... I just watched it again and I had superimposed Stewart/Said into the 10 car pile up during the Nationwide race, same part of the track. (*Said was involved in that one too)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHOImv8L0rY&feature=related

Correction: Said pushed him out there and hung him out to dry... Stewart's mostly in the clear. I say mostly b/c he still turned Said on purpose.

Penalty - 3 legged race around the paddock - LeMons style.

[Fbody383]

Does he have the right to force Smoke four off? Did he "force" him off or did Burger King Boy demand to keep an unfavorable position? How can he be forced 4 off when other cars are driving much futher out there on the apron?

How much room is Said required to yield against a fixed barrier?

[evarner]

Fully funded ego-typical driver teaching a non-funded driver a lesson on the road course.

Intentional = yes

If the ego-typical driver was actually sparring with skill, he could have passed him at will.

Guess this stuff makes for good ratings. IMHO - bring back the real drivers in real cars.

[mitchntx]

bring back the real drivers in real cars.

Exactly ... sorry I missed you at TWS.