AST Contingency

[Jeremy Gunter]

http://www.camaromustangchallenge.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=31418#31418

[BlueFirePony]

So whatever happened to the contingency in 2010. I know several of you have their product and others running the decals.
I went to register last summer and got bounced (i.e form failed to submit) so I put a reminder in to check later and by the time I did (albeit several months later) the info was off the NASA site.
I just submitted my registration to this form - it worked this time.

[chris-CMC#35]

These guys are a total sham, is what happened. Damn near every AI-CMC driver in Rocky Mtn registered. Not a single one ever got anything.

Plus, they don't make a shock for the CMC price point anymore.

So, if you show up with these things on your car, it will not pass tech.


-chris

[GlennCMC70]

These guys are a total sham, is what happened. Damn near every AI-CMC driver in Rocky Mtn registered. Not a single one ever got anything.

Plus, they don't make a shock for the CMC price point anymore.

So, if you show up with these things on your car, it will not pass tech.


-chris

You ever consider confiding w/ the other Directors before you make a statement like that?

[chris-CMC#35]

Good point. But this pitch was way too fat to miss... :wink:

[GlennCMC70]

Good point. But this pitch was way too fat to miss... :wink:

I'm on your side, but you would have hung me out w/ the wash (as you have in the past) for such a comment. Lets take this to private and address it (again - I know).

[marshall_mosty]

Who has spare decals?

[Wirtz]

Brian from AST asked me to post this as he is not yet registered for the forum. If you have any comments, or want to take issue, I'd suggest contacting Brian directly.



Guys,
Before we read more "we are a sham comments" I figured I'd chime in. Last year's program from our view went fairly smoothly. It was well received in NASA and SCCA. Every person that registered got stickers that we know of. We found several registrations caught in our spam box when those folks called or emailed us, we found them and straightened it out. If they did inquire and we didn't respond for some reason, I apologize. If they didn’t ask and we missed it in the hundreds of spam emails we get daily, I apologize, but it wasn’t recognized until later in the season.

Towards the end of the season, we did get behind with claims and when people were ready to buy, we always honored the claim form regardless. In fact, several times people wanted to register the day before an event and we accepted their claims even if we couldn’t get stickers to them in time.

This year I made a more automated registration and put someone in charge of the whole program. I think it will run better this year. I'm not sure how much we will be at the track for the 2011 Texas Region season. With our Grand Am contract and World Challenge sponsorship, we have a lot of conflicts unfortunately. But we will do our best to show our support. We hope to make it to NASA Nationals since it is the week before we need to be there anyway.

In regards to making shocks to the CMC rules. That information is simply false. Anyone who has asked for shocks can purchase 1 axle’s worth for $799. Are we currently stocking CMC shocks for S197, SN95, 3rd and 4th Gen Camaro? No, the demand has been underwhelming to say the least. If anyone asks for CMC shocks, we make them to order and have done so for anyone who has asked. No one has paid more than $799 per axle and no one has received $5,000 shocks for $1598 because we “winked” and gave them the buddy deal. We can’t stay in business like that.

To be honest, we support CMC because we *like* the racing and we *like* the guys we meet at the track. We’re not doing it to get rich or somehow wreck what is already a well run organization. I’m not sure why we’ve stirred up so much hostility towards the idea of running a new shock in the class. If you’re not interested in something new, vote with your dollars and stick with what’s on your car.

Have a great season. Stop by our trailer whether we’re at a NASA event or Grand Am event if you have questions.

Brian Hanchey
President of AST Suspension - USA

NOTE: I would have posted this myself, but the registration process seems to be broken on the forum. Please email us or call for questions. www-ast-usa.com has our contact information.

[Jeremy Gunter]

I got my shocks within a week. Brian even spent some time with me in his shop explaining what's going on inside of them. Quite worth the money in my opinion. After the first full weekend on them, I wouldn't put anything else under any race car I drive... (if I have a choice)

A sham is far from the truth... My next purchase is their air jacks!!! :P

[Jeremy Gunter]

Who has spare decals?

I will stop by there tomorrow on my way to OKC, hopefully they are around! It might be a few weeks before they get back to the shop...

[mitchntx]

Must be your sparkling personality. :wink:

I know I tried to get a set and couldn't get the time of day.



Edit:
I've gotten a couple PMs and e-mails asking what my issues were. So, I'll post what my experience was.

First of all, Jeff, with all due respect, making and maintaining contact with AST was my issue. So taking it off-line, from my experience, is futile.

When the AST folks came to ECR last fall, I met him, shook his hand and told him I needed a set of rear shocks. He nodded politely and then went on about his way.

Then later on, I think Jeremiah posted a link for some "Camaro" shocks.

I e-mailed AST asking what years they fit. The response was "Camaro". That's it.

So I e-mailed again asking specifics about 3rd gen or 4th gen fitment, valving and stroke. His response was "Like Jeff Wirtz's car."

Again, I e-mailed back that I wasn't comfortable debriefing a competitor on his set up. Response was "No longer available."

So I tried on two different occasions to buy shocks from AST. I just got the vibe that I wasn't on his priority list. That concerned me because shocks don't last forever and need servicing ever couple years. What kind of follow-up service could I expect based upon my atempt at initial purchase?

I do hope that this is AST growing pains. The series needs more suppliers as these platforms are starting to get long in the tooth.

But my experience has been anything but


7.33.6 Any non-remote reservoir shock absorbers, of any origin, that are readily available to the public from a retail source for less than $800 a pair may be used provided they attach to the OEM stock unmodified mounting points and do not alter the stock geometry, with the exceptions outlined in 7.33.8 below.

If AST can't or won't supply a shock for a 4th gen, then please tell me and this is a moot point.

[AllZWay]

I had no luck either and had to buy elsewhere.

[Jeremy Gunter]

But my experience has been anything but


7.33.6 Any non-remote reservoir shock absorbers, of any origin, that are readily available to the public from a retail source for less than $800 a pair may be used provided they attach to the OEM stock unmodified mounting points and do not alter the stock geometry, with the exceptions outlined in 7.33.8 below.

If AST can't or won't supply a shock for a 4th gen, then please tell me and this is a moot point.

They never stocked our price range of shocks before someone brought them the data and asked them to create them. These are still in the early stages of design and production. Now they are available. They are trying to help us, maybe you could try to help them help you... Brian is a good guy, and he will work with you, but you might need to bring him some data... If you want him to supply you with their shock at this price range.


7.33.6 Any non-remote reservoir shock absorbers, of any origin, that are readily available to the public from a retail source for less than $800 a pair may be used provided they attach to the OEM stock unmodified mounting points and do not alter the stock geometry, with the exceptions outlined in 7.33.8 below.

This was my experience... and could be yours with a bit of effort. Thanks to Captain Jeremiah I didn't have to do the leg work.

You'll need more than a shock Mitch!!! :twisted:

[mitchntx]

Not sure what more I could have done. Talking face to face and e-mailing certainly wasn't working ... in my case.

Trust me ... I realize NO vendor can maintain a supply of shocks to cover all spring rates, ride heights and travel lengths.

To me, "readily available" means some one who I can give my needs to, take my money and give me product in return.

And my last statement was meant to mean if AST decides not to support the 4th gen, then it is what it is. I would just like to have known that.

[GlennCMC70]

I know this is posted on the Texas AI/CMC site, but this is the same song, second verse from region to region. Mitch's is one example of "getting nowhere" w/ face to face converations as well as internet contact. Add to this more than a few dozen having issues redeaming the contingincy. Its a common problem.

Lets hope it is a matter of "growing pains" and it has all been resolved.
I'm glad they offer a shock for the Fox/SN-95 and 3rd gen. No-one else have ever been able to get thier shocks under the price point. That and I'm tired of those guys crying foul about the 4th gen having an advantage in this area. Looks like another reason to pop those Mustangs back up to 3150-3200.

[michaelmosty]

Looks like another reason to pop those Mustangs back up to 3150-3200.
OK, most Mustangs are at 3150-3200. The only one that isn't is the Fox and it has the most narrow track width of any platform.

[GlennCMC70]

Looks like another reason to pop those Mustangs back up to 3150-3200.
OK, most Mustangs are at 3150-3200. The only one that isn't is the Fox and it has the most narrow track width of any platform.

It is also the shortest.
Race shock availability was always an issue w/ those 3 platforms I mentioned.

[marshall_mosty]

Race shock availability was always an issue w/ those 3 platforms I mentioned.
We could all start eating cake and the shocks shall fall from the sky like manna from heaven...

[michaelmosty]

Do you really want to make lists of the advantages of each platform?

OK, the fox is 13" shorter in body length than your Camaro.
"Some" Mustangs are lighter.

Start a new thread to build on this list and I will start drawing up my list. :wink:

[MikeP99Z]

Posting this to nip some rumors in bud.

I have a custom set of ASTs on my car. They are not legal for CMC. They are rod/rod ended with custom valving, dual adjustable, remote reservoir, full coil over.

I've had great customer service from Brian and Stuart.

To make a long story short - my rear shocks were bottoming out, but that was not the fault of AST. I mis-spec'd the rear shock length when I had them built because I forgot to include the height of my custom rear upper shock mounts.

So rather than me having to rebuild a new set of rear shocks, I'm lowering my rear shock mount by that distance. After much debate at Nationals, I decided that it was unsafe to try a track fix because I have full rear suspension load on those mounts.

I'll do what I can to visit with Brian and Stuart to make sure the CMC 4th gen rears are in stock and ready to go when people order them.

MP

[mitchntx]

Posting this to nip some rumors in bud.


For the record, I haven't spoken to any one about your shocks, Mike.

On the contrary, I've tried really hard to just post my experience in a factual manner.

[Jeremy Gunter]

Brian still hasn't received his log in approval, so he hasn't been able to respond.

From all of my experiences, I would say they are a first class company. Although, I will agree they are small and it took me a couple of calls to get my questions answered and shocks on the way. There are many others that are very happy with their experiences. I am truly sorry your experiences are not as positive as mine. From what I have been told, there are others in this series that aren't happy. Please e-mail me with your issues and experiences, and I will gather this data for AST. Any and all questions and concerns are welcome.

Directors, please check your inbox...

Thanks!
Jeremy Gunter
JSGunter@gmail.com

If you would like to contact ast-usa.com directly
sales@ast-usa.com

Ph: 972.424.3700
Fx: 972.424.3755

[MikeP99Z]

The contingency program was change to an automated system this year, which is working better than last years manual system. AST is clarifying the program with NASA National. A dedicated person is being hired part time each week to manage the contingency program.

Part numbers - a set of 4 shocks for CMC for $1598:

Fox - ACS-F-1002S

SN-95 - ACS-F-1002S

S197 - ACS-F-1003S

3rd Gen - AVS-C-8001S

4th Gen - AVS-C-8002S

[jeremiahkellam]

The contingency program was change to an automated system this year, which is working better than last years manual system. AST is clarifying the program with NASA National. A dedicated person is being hired part time each week to manage the contingency program.

Part numbers - a set of 4 shocks for CMC for $1598:

Fox - ACS-F-1002S

SN-95 - ACS-F-1002S

S197 - ACS-F-1003S

3rd Gen - AVS-C-8001S

4th Gen - AVS-C-8002S

http://www.ast-usa.com/resources/AST_Retail_Pricing_2010.pdf

[BlueFirePony]

Mike/Jeremy/JK
Can you guys clarify for me the S197 spec and price. Unless I am reading all this wrong (and there is always that chance), per Mike's post it is ACS-F-1003S @ $1598 which is much more acceptable pricewise than the $2600 for 1001S on the 2010 price sheet. They are both in the 4001 series right so is this a price and spec change, just a price change with new model number or two different specs in the same product series?
If I need to just call AST myself let me know and I can do that.

[MikeP99Z]

1001S is a different kit which includes aluminum rear shocks with remote adjusters and ride height adjusters. (Pricing for the 1001S kit will be updated, and less, for 2011)

The 1003S kit is just the set of single adjustable steel shocks.

[Jeremy Gunter]

They aren't the same shocks. The CMC version is steel front and rear and does not include ride height adjusters for the rear. The 4100 street has an aluminum inverted rear shock and the ride height adjuster.

From brian

[BlueFirePony]

Thx Mike and Jeremy!

OK so the 1001S is part of the AI "arms race" - got it.
Are there any spec sheets on the single adjustables? I looked on the AST site and did not see anything that indicated force v velocity - well there was an article about an Evo but it was not complete. I understand the dynamics involved and just want a reference - not in the position to purchase at this point but we are looking to build another car and it may well be a CMC2 car for next year ...or the year after.....

assuming tire issue is resolved soon!