I can not believe this has been posted. I have not made a final decision.
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I can not believe this has been posted. I have not made a final decision.
wow...where to start.
Mitch, the entire premise of your argument is wrong. This incident was decided as at fault. Therefore we would expect a penalty. He isnt being penalized for being on probation as you said. He's being penalized for being at fault for causing an incident that resulted in damage.
Figure 12 does not apply in this case. It was discussed. Figure 12 covers a situation where the overtaken car turns in at the usual turn in point in spite of the fact that there is a car in the way. Thats not what happened.
The view of the IRB was that Glenn attempted a pass and was not fully in control of his car in the execution of that pass. He lost control of the car and the reason for it is he went in too deep, too fast: a botched passing attempt. The fact that the contact itself occured after Glenn had cleared Rob does not wipe clean the fact that Glenn got himself into that situation because of the passing attempt.
So, once the IRB established that it was at fault, the question becomes what the penalty should be. Here in Texas the typical penalty for at fault with damage is a DQ and probation. The IRB decided this had to be escalated, did so, and put it into Clifton. Clifton gave it the green light, Todd told Glenn, Glenn appealed a specific part of the penalty...and apparently Todd thought Clifton had made his decision on that appeal but now it looks like that's not the case. I'll leave that to Todd and Clifton to clear up.
David...I'm still not clear, sorry. I'll call you. No you're not on probation, you would know if you were.
There is no written definition in the CCR about how to serve suspensions. The accepted practice is you have to be capable of running the sessions you are serving the suspension for. In other words, you cannot serve your suspension when your car is in pieces in the paddock. You similarly cannot serve your suspension by not running races at a NASA event at VIR when you live in LA.
The reason we excluded Nationals from the suspension period was as follows. Nationals is different than regional races as it requires a significantly higher amount of money and time to participate. There are prizes on the line, along with more notoriety than normal. A penalty that results in someone not participating in that event therefore is more severe than one that results in only missing a regional event. We wanted a two race suspension. That two race suspension impacting Nationals would therefore be more of a penalty than had it occurred at a time that it did not impact Nationals.
Look at it this way...if the incident had happened at Hallett, we would've been looking for the two race suspension which Glenn would've been able to serve without impacting Nationals. We didnt want the timing of the penalty to make it more punitive than intended.
Al, you called and asked me to call you.
Don't worry about it.
I highly suggest anyone that cares to talk about this on here or anywhere else first make sure they have read the CCR for anything that pertains to this situation. As Al said anyone that has a comment to make on it please post up or contact Al. But as the CCR states to IRB members be careful not to rely on your racers instict to decide a case.
27.11 Penalties
These are general guidelines for standard penalties. They may be additive or multiplicative depending on the situation and the person’s past record. The IRB may invoke more severe penalties for repeated violations. Any deviation from these guidelines should be justified in the report to the Race Director.
Obviously I have spent a lot of time on this issue so I'm curious what the rest of the group thinks. If you don't feel like posting give me a call.
Who's on first?
jb
Not sure ... but the last at bat whiffed on a low and outside slider.Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffburch
This whole deal must be generating some interest outside the confines of registered AI/CMC folks ...
Quote:
In total there are 13 users online :: 1 Registered, 0 Hidden and 12 Guests
After the last fly ball, I believe Clifton was at bat. Just waiting for the pitch...
Todd
"Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but not their own facts." --Daniel Patrick Moynihan
I'm staying out of this, but I will say this...Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd Covini
A fact is the opinion of how the data should be manipulated
First I have to say I consider Glenn a very good friend. I hope he knows that.
I have mixed emotions about this whole thing. On the one hand you have to go by the CCR. I don't agree with alot of the CCR plus I think it needs some additions but it is our rulebook. On the other hand Glenn has been driving out of control IMHO way to much in the last two years. To many low percentage moves and I think he was completely out of control all through the pass on Rob. Rob sees him comming and stays outside. How bad would it have been if Rob had turned in normal instead of seeing Glenn and knowing what Glenn was going to do? Expectiing it. Several drivers (guys way faster than I) have bitched about this for a while. I'm glad I was not on the IRB.
JJ