Class Spec discussion

maybe I am missing something here. but why call it CMC 2? why not just another step/jump? CMC is the king in Texas today, but tomorrow will hold a different set of racers, some old and experienced some new and crazy.
(like ross and I) (shouldn't put words in Ross's mouth, but I am sure he will agree)
"CMC2" will grow. as kids come up and their dream car was not a fox or third gen, but a 5th gen or SN97. Guys will still build cars on the cheap to go out and compete. And it will still be a favorite to watch!

The directors are busy with other stuff, including their own families and lives, why take up their time figuring out how to get a 1986 third gen and a 2008 GT mustang to be equal, just give it a different name and save them the trouble. We will still take the same green, on the same track, on the same weekend, in the same pit, sharing the same homebrew with the same group of badass guys.

Sure the classes won't be even, but would the effort by our directors be better spent testing telemetry on cars spanning 25 years or researching ways to get 15+ cars per class each weekend?

edited for Glennism's :shock:

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Originally Posted by Jeremy Gunter

We will still take the same green, on the same track, on the same weekend, in the same pit, sharing the same homebrew with the same group of badass guys.

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That's what I'm talkin about!!

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Originally Posted by mitchntx

There is a whole new generation of racers headed our way. New does not mean stoopid. Fresh ideas, fresh perspectives, fresh points of view are welcome as fas as I'm concerned.

A slippery slope doesn't always face downhill ...

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Originally Posted by Jeremy Gunter

Sure the classes won't be even, but would the effort by our directors be better spent testing telemetry on cars spanning 25 years or researching ways to get 15+ cars per class each weekend?

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Damn ... Jeremy, for a Ford guy, you're pretty sharp. :P

Thanks for the reality check!!!!!!

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Originally Posted by Jeremy Gunter

Sure the classes won't be even, but would the effort by our directors be better spent testing telemetry on cars spanning 25 years or researching ways to get 15+ cars per class each weekend?

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Pretty much a sad reality that they are spinning their wheels jerking around trying to homologate cars that don't exist in the series all the while pissing off their existing core racers....AND fail to build the series through marketing and such.

Oh, that's right, this is their hobby job done on the side... Until NASA can generate enough money that the 8 or 10 "players" that run the show can do this full time, we are just going to have to settle with what they can dedicate to it.

Besides, Jeremy was right, it's not about the winning and glory, it's about hanging out at the track and shootin' the shit with ya'll!

one thing to remember is the SCCA and T2 cars have a life span. after a number of years (5 or 6) they are no longer legal for T2. NASA is smart to do their best to give those guys a place to race. that place is CMC-2.
you guys are correct that it would be nice to have 15+ car fields in CMC and CMC-2. but i would rather see 30 car fields in CMC or CMC-2. i wish we had so many cars that only the top 50 qual times were allowed to race.

if i were you guys w/ the 5.0 cars, i wouldnt worry about it.
i think Adam is on the right track getting w/ Tony and looking to get some info out there about this. dont think it hasnt been done, but he may get farther than others. one thing to remember is to not get emotional about this. present your thoughts to Tony in a civil manner. he will listen if you just talk w/ him.

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Originally Posted by GlennCMC70

one thing to remember is the SCCA and T2 cars have a life span. after a number of years (5 or 6) they are no longer legal for T2. NASA is smart to do their best to give those guys a place to race. that place is CMC-2.
you guys are correct that it would be nice to have 15+ car fields in CMC and CMC-2. but i would rather see 30 car fields in CMC or CMC-2. i wish we had so many cars that only the top 50 qual times were allowed to race.

if i were you guys w/ the 5.0 cars, i wouldnt worry about it.
i think Adam is on the right track getting w/ Tony and looking to get some info out there about this. dont think it hasnt been done, but he may get farther than others. one thing to remember is to not get emotional about this. present your thoughts to Tony in a civil manner. he will listen if you just talk w/ him.

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Right on... also keep in mind that if they only hear it from Adam "We need a road map and a plan for _____________" that is just one voice... I suggest that if you are conserned and you want that map... or whatever you want to call it, ask them as well. The more people that contact then and ask the more they will become concerned.

DD

All I am concerned about is whoopin everyone's ASS at Hallett!! :twisted:

i would be too if it was you. you dont have a chance in hell and your record there sucks! :P

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Originally Posted by Rsmith350

I hope this thread becomes a constructive and pertinent discussion.

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Originally Posted by michaelmosty

All I am concerned about is whoopin everyone's ASS at Hallett!! :twisted:

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Originally Posted by GlennCMC70

i would be too if it was you. you dont have a chance in hell and your record there sucks! :P

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Full circle ... 8)

The only thing I'll add is to keep in mind that we ALL have to spend money "to make the number" regardless of platform.

We've all had to spend money to keep the power trains alive regardless of platform.

We've all had our share of internet glory regardless of platform.

I really do think all the hoopla about spending mega-dollars is a non-issue. I honestly think that if a formula that is REASONABLY cost effective is discovered, then the 2 classes will merge. If not, then it will be CMC/CMC2 till does happen.

But, to make it happen, there are gonna have to be some paradigm changes, like aftermarket engine components, ECM alterations, weight penalties, etc.

Evolve ...

This is all very interesting to me as I just spent upwards of $3,500 on my 5 liter. $1,800 plus on a full rebuild and an additional $1,600 plus on Cobra parts. I haven't dyno'd it yet but my set-up reportedly barely makes the numbers in TX. I say TX because CA cars seam to magically make 20 HP more with the same set-ups.

I've heard of the goal to eventually have a single CMC class again but I just don't see it as possible without a negative impact to the series as a whole. CMC was built on cost containment and the formula works well. There is just too much delta between 20 years of cars in some 6 or 7 plateforms. It's impossible to equalize an LS1 and 302/305 without costing somebody a fortune. Not to mention wheels, brakes, and other factors that would probably make building older cars cost prohibited.

Keeping the classes seperate would allow for the most cost efficient racing within each as opposed to certain guys having to spend much more based on platform of choice. Do you force the LS1 guy to down grade wheels, engine, brakes, ect to fit in or do you force the 5 liter guys upgrade the same? Either way, there's too much delta present and trying to equalize the them all is a very expesive proposition. As I see it, CMC has evolved into 2 classes. It's simply where Detroit forced us to go and it's probably best left that way for the health of CMC now and in the future.

rb