Intake tube location

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02-01-2011, 03:40 PM
edrock96GT

Intake tube location

Ok. Some of you saw my cool relocated intake this weekend, but Marshall brought up a point that might not be legal (not complaining in any way, just pointing it out) so I said I'd look it up and I found this:

7.3 Frame
The entire tub, floorpan, firewall, and frame assemblies including the cowl and windshield frame must
remain in the stock position and cannot be relocated. “Cowl” is defined as the metal structure installed by
the factory between the firewall and base of the windshield. “Frame” and “frame rail” are defined as the
parallel boxed metal rails running the length of the car that form the basis of the unibody or frame.
“Floorpan” is defined as the sheet metal forming the floor and trunk floor of the car. Cars may not be
“channeled” to raise the floor within the body or lower the body below the frame rails. The only
modifications to these structures allowed will be in the following instances and no secondary purpose for
a modification is allowed (i.e. electrical cable passage facilitating suspension clearance). If a modification
is not listed below it is specifically not allowed.

b) To facilitate plumbing or electrical access. For AIX only, plumbing shall include intercooler or intake
piping, but all air intakes must be mounted outside the cockpit.

It was an oversight on my part, but before I go doing more work than I have to I would like to submit it for approval, or get an official ruling for what to do with it.

Some options I see so far are:
1. Put it all back (rerun wiring, etc.).

2. Get it approved and leave it (maybe submit a rule change?) as it doesn't provide any advantage.

3. I race in AIX, where it's legal.

I'm not trying to make waves, push the limits of the CCR or challenge the wording to the letter or anything. Just trying to see where this stands.

TBH, if it doesn't get blessed off I'm really leaning toward my 3rd option.

If anyone is wondering why I did all the work relocating it in the first place, I was tired of seeing this every 2 or 3 events:
http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/i...6/DSCF0257.jpg
02-01-2011, 03:50 PM
GlennCMC70

Pics of your set-up would help.
02-01-2011, 04:00 PM
edrock96GT

For everyone to see:
http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/i...6/DSCF0263.jpg
http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/i...6/DSCF0258.jpg
http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/i...6/DSCF0259.jpg
http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/i...6/DSCF0260.jpg
http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/i...6/DSCF0261.jpg
02-01-2011, 05:21 PM
MikeP99Z

That's not legal in AI or AIX.
02-01-2011, 06:04 PM
Rob Liebbe

Ed,

Mike is right. We've also had a quick round of e-mails between Glenn, Todd, Al and myself and also agree that it is not legal in AI or AIX.

The timing of your inquiry as well as the honesty in your approach is great. Because this was not noticed as illegal by any officials this past weekend, your results will not be affected. However, now that it is known and there is notice to you of the problem, you are required to fix it before the next race your car participates in or risk a DQ.

Double check the AI rules regarding the intake location as it needs to be removed from the cockpit. You will also need to make repairs to any holes in the firewall that you may have created or modified. Todd has stated that a simple metal cover plate will suffice.

From the AI rules...

7.3 Frame
The entire tub, floorpan, firewall, and frame assemblies including the cowl and windshield frame must
remain in the stock position and cannot be relocated. “Cowl” is defined as the metal structure installed by
the factory between the firewall and base of the windshield. “Frame” and “frame rail” are defined as the
parallel boxed metal rails running the length of the car that form the basis of the unibody or frame.
“Floorpan” is defined as the sheet metal forming the floor and trunk floor of the car. Cars may not be
“channeled” to raise the floor within the body or lower the body below the frame rails. The only
modifications to these structures allowed will be in the following instances and no secondary purpose for
a modification is allowed (i.e. electrical cable passage facilitating suspension clearance). If a modification
is not listed below it is specifically not allowed.
a) To facilitate the addition of safety equipment such as subframe connectors and roll cage bracing (i.e.
roll cage may extend through the firewall to strut towers);
b) To facilitate plumbing or electrical access. For AIX only, plumbing shall include intercooler or intake
piping, but all air intakes must be mounted outside the cockpit.

I apologize for not catching this when you showed it to me, I'm still learning the ropes.

I hope you can get it done before the next event. Let the group know if you need any help.
02-01-2011, 06:39 PM
marshall_mosty

Okay, now to put this on spin cycle...

What if Eddie built a box around the air filter and ran a hose from the box to a NACA duct in the 1/4 window? Therefore, the air intake would be from outside the car... legal??

The reason I bring this up is I was thinking of the same thing to try and get the air filter drawing some cold air and not subject to all the engine bay "crap"...
02-01-2011, 06:55 PM
mitchntx

Re: Intake tube location

Quote:

Originally Posted by edrock96GT

http://i263.photobucket.com/albums/i...6/DSCF0257.jpg

Eddie ... c'mon, dude.

That's your designated dyno cert filter.

:shock: :lol:

And before any one blows a gasket ... it's a joke.

Nice Roper washer, BTW.
02-01-2011, 07:20 PM
Crumpacker

I could see the "no air filters in the cockpit" rule from a safety standpoint... I helped a friend pull a blown LS1 from his 4th gen and there were holes in his air filter from bits of piston along with a broken airbox. There was a trail of piston debris from the air filter down to the cylinders. It let go at wot (as most engines do) and I imagine there was quite a fireball accompanying the debris through the air filter.
02-01-2011, 07:27 PM
edrock96GT

:lol: Nice, Mitch!

But, yeah...what Marshall said. Only reason I moved it was to find a clean, protected place for it that wasn't sucking in hot engine air or getting beat to hell in the fenderwell.

Call me new, but I don't see why there would even be a rule prohibiting it.
02-01-2011, 07:36 PM
Crumpacker

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ao8z...eature=related
02-01-2011, 07:49 PM
MikeP99Z

Quote:

Originally Posted by marshall_mosty

Okay, now to put this on spin cycle...

What if Eddie built a box around the air filter and ran a hose from the box to a NACA duct in the 1/4 window? Therefore, the air intake would be from outside the car... legal??

The reason I bring this up is I was thinking of the same thing to try and get the air filter drawing some cold air and not subject to all the engine bay "crap"...

The whole thing is still in the cockpit...
02-01-2011, 07:54 PM
edrock96GT

Sam. That's what happened to my old stock intake. :lol:

But that was nitrous. Besides, I think if there was any kind of mishap with the force needed to send debris through the air filter, on 5.0 and 4.6 intakes, it would blow the pipe off of the throttle body instead.
02-01-2011, 07:56 PM
MikeP99Z

Marshall - Let me put my motor in the passenger seat and build a box around it. As long as the dashboard clears it, it should be legal. :shock: :P
02-01-2011, 08:10 PM
edrock96GT

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeP99Z

Marshall - Let me put my motor in the passenger seat and build a box around it. As long as the dashboard clears it, it should be legal. :shock: :P

Putting it like that makes it seem like it's an issue of fairness due to weight transfer, not really safety. I drove a Bradley Fighting Vehicle for a year. It has a 903ci tubo diesel six inches to the right of the driver separated by removable 1/8th" aluminum panels.

I'm just trying to get some honest, straight forward feedback on the pros and cons of putting the filter in the cockpit.
02-01-2011, 08:13 PM
mitchntx

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crumpacker

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ao8zqgweDo&feature=related

That looks like the dyno at SpeedTek.
02-01-2011, 09:18 PM
MikeP99Z

Quote:

Originally Posted by edrock96GT

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeP99Z

Marshall - Let me put my motor in the passenger seat and build a box around it. As long as the dashboard clears it, it should be legal. :shock: :P

Putting it like that makes it seem like it's an issue of fairness due to weight transfer, not really safety. I drove a Bradley Fighting Vehicle for a year. It has a 903ci tubo diesel six inches to the right of the driver separated by removable 1/8th" aluminum panels.

I'm just trying to get some honest, straight forward feedback on the pros and cons of putting the filter in the cockpit.

just joking.

The Bradley sounds like a cool vehicle.
02-01-2011, 09:20 PM
MikeP99Z

Also, you guys drive Fords, so anything is possible within the ruleset. 8)
02-01-2011, 09:46 PM
marshall_mosty

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeP99Z

Marshall - Let me put my motor in the passenger seat and build a box around it. As long as the dashboard clears it, it should be legal. :shock: :P

Mike,
If you can make it happen, I will close a blind eye. 8)
02-02-2011, 08:55 AM
michaelmosty

Quote:

Originally Posted by marshall_mosty

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeP99Z

Marshall - Let me put my motor in the passenger seat and build a box around it. As long as the dashboard clears it, it should be legal. :shock: :P

Mike,
If you can make it happen, I will close a blind eye. 8)

If you are blind, why would you need to close your eyes? :?