MSR-C and our normal pit area - now is GRID!

In case you have not seen the post on the NASA forums.....
The "skid pad", where we have parked for longer than I have been racing w/ NASA, will now be the grid. The old grid will now be post race tech/impound.
I have sent an email to Dave asking for an area to be designated as AI/CMC pits. I'm hoping to know more in the coming days.

Anyone have an area they think would be good and big enough?
We will likely be required to park all trailers in the grass since not having the skidpad will take away alot of parking area and displace those folks into a smaller area. Things are likely to get tight. I have some ideas, but I'll wait and see what you guys think and what Dave comes back w/.
I just wanted to get the word out that we can no longer park where we have.

The problem is that he is taking the area that we used and not opening up another area.

I can't remember anywhere that is 1/10 the size that we need.

Lets be positive here. I don't like having that area taken from us, but I also understand the problems of having grid under the covered area we have always had it when we have 40+ cars in a single class. This is one time where I am glad to see them try something different.

Jack needs to pave more parking.

If it rains we can't drive anything off the pavement. I really wonder how they are going to pull this off. We usually take almost all the paved area.

JJ

Jack needs to do a lot of things.
I'lm used to going off road anyhow. Not much to be positive about. No electrical, no garages, and no parking.
The only positive I see is praying for no rain, hanging out with my CMC race buddies, and of course RACING!!!!
it don't get any better. See you there. Bring your barbie (that's BBQ for the Texans), and well have a ol' fashion cookout.

What were the problems with having the grid under the covered area?

Not enough room for all the cars trying to grid. If you put them 2 deep (on each side) it blocks the access in and out of the track exit for cars and emergency vehicles.
Lets not debate whether or not there are issues there. Lets deal w/ the fact that we have been asked to not grid there. Find a new home and see what happens. It could very well be that the new grid location reveals new issue that would require a new option. It could also allow us to move to move to a place we end up liking better.
I think a new grid and track entrance and exit needs to be worked out. I don't think that track was designed/built w/ racing in mind, only HPDE type events and use. One dead give away of this - no start/finish flag stand. It is the only track we race at w/out one.

Fair enough, there is not enough room to grid. For that reason they need to take our "home", your word, but haven't offered us a new option.

Now I know Dave, and I think he will come through, but so far it sounds like my company's IT department. And don't get me started on my company's IT department...-

So they thought long and hard about getting cars into/off of track, but not about where to park them when not racing.......uummmm. let's hope that is not as far as their minds went. I would hope that we just don't showing up in a parking free-for-all with big transporters and trailers and motorhomes parking all over the place. In dry weather, chaotic. In the rain, dangerous and disastrous... especially on the side of the hill.
I'm sure all the folks that have their special garages will enjoy all of us plugging up their access to the garages.
Just hope there is a plan.
I'm with Wayne on this one.

If they grid in our spot, I'd be happy to grid under the cover ;-p They only need a couple of spots for the scales...

I parked down at the bottom of the hill last year when I was in DE and it was a disaster then even with all of you guys at the top of the hill. Not really sure how this is going to work if they havent added any more pavement since then.

Maybe we can get at the end of the last building between there and the road comming into the track. If I remember there is a lot of pavement and some grass area for the trailers between pavement and the entrance road. I plan to leave early Friday morning but it will be 9 or 10 before I can get there. Can someone go early and stake out an area for us?


JJ

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Originally Posted by ShadowBolt

Maybe we can get at the end of the last building between there and the road comming into the track. If I remember there is a lot of pavement and some grass area for the trailers between pavement and the entrance road. I plan to leave early Friday morning but it will be 9 or 10 before I can get there. Can someone go early and stake out an area for us?


JJ

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I've asked about staking off an area. I have not got a reply back from Dave yet.

Well this will be a total cluster. May have to park at TWS or HH.

Do they really need the whole skipad just for grid? That really displaces alot of racers without any option for pavement. Which means really soft ground and you know it will likely will be wet when you show up or rain while you are there. Hope they have a big tractor or something to pull everyone out. I would suggest parking as high up as possible like where you sign in for the event at the top of the hill before you make a right to grid or left to the clubhouse. They don't allow parking in the paved area in front of all the garages either. Be a good trial run this year though as I understand the idea of needing more space for grid.

I just got a respoce from Dave. We will need to work this out on our own. I'm liking the area to the left where the entrance road "T's" into the road from the clubhouse up to grid. We can also use the area down the hill from there closest to the track. I was cautioned about displacing another group from thier "normal" spot. W/out knowing any of this and where other folks "normal" spots are, this will be hard. I'll see about getting a map drawn up and posted by weeks end.

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Originally Posted by HoustonNW

What were the problems with having the grid under the covered area?

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20-30 spaces don't work for 40-50 car grids.

Also that area is being turned into a useful tech area, as tech where it used to be doesn't work.

Any of the other groups don't get to park together. Not sure if that's because they don't really try or what though...

to boil it down into one word: progress!

My opinion is all groups should be required to pit together. Respect for your fellow racer is hard to have when the only time you see them is on track. Being and feeling like part of a group will result in a lot more fun for all.

I understand the theory that Dave is trying to do. It does become a mess with larger groups, and with some cars trying to grid coming from the opposite direction and all, meanwhile trying to get cars off track etc etc. Is TT using the full course? I dont' know what walls are out there, but is there any way we could park in the pits of the new part of the track (west of the skidpad)?

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Originally Posted by GlennCMC70

I was cautioned about displacing another group from thier "normal" spot. W/out knowing any of this and where other folks "normal" spots are, this will be hard.

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Tough $hit. Occupy Cresson!

Remember we're not the only ones who used the skidpad either. There always seems to be a couple of guys with the big rigs who pit out there with us too. Those guys will be scrambling for space also, and I doubt they want to park those rigs in the grass. This is going to get real interesting if we have to pit on the grass, even if it's not wet. TWS and MSRH it's a non-issue, and with EC and HMRC, you can pit (trailer/tow vehicle) in gravel/grass, but there's plenty of room to get the racecar on asphalt/concrete. The road to the track enterance isn't really wide enough for this since there will already be two way traffic. Even for minor work like brake pads and swapping tires around, jacking up a car in the grass is no bueno, the jack doesn't roll or instead pulls the cradle and jack stands sink. You can bet I'm going to be heading up there early Friday to grab a spot where I can at least park Knocker on some hard ground. If it's someone elses usual spot, sorry.

I can assure you none us will park our racecar on the grass. Trailer, yes. Tow rig, yes.
Using part of the new track could be a better solution. I was thinking of a way to have pitout and pit in in different places. I'll look at the track and see if it can be done. If TT is running the 3.1, it will not work obviously.
All I can say is I'm glad we know prior to Sat morning this time.

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Originally Posted by GlennCMC70

I just got a respoce from Dave. We will need to work this out on our own. I'm liking the area to the left where the entrance road "T's" into the road from the clubhouse up to grid. We can also use the area down the hill from there closest to the track. I was cautioned about displacing another group from thier "normal" spot. W/out knowing any of this and where other folks "normal" spots are, this will be hard. I'll see about getting a map drawn up and posted by weeks end.

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That is the area I was talking about.

I agree with Gary on the tuff $hit about parking in someone's spot. I had "my spot" at ECR for two years then this last year some of our own guys took it. First come, first served.

Think of last year with all the big rigs up on the hill with us. Now think of all those people parking in the space that is left. Now think if it rains.......


JJ

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Originally Posted by ShadowBolt

I agree with Gary on the tuff $hit about parking in someone's spot. I had "my spot" at ECR for two years then this last year some of our own guys took it.

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It's all up for grabs once you shuffle one big group... the week before we need a good headcount so the early birds can stake the claim.

TT will be using the 3.1. And we may not be the only group doing so as well...

Attachment 995

Here is a (borrowed) map of MSR parking areas. I don't know if it's to scale, but it gives you an idea.

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Originally Posted by kbrewmr2

TT will be using the 3.1. And we may not be the only group doing so as well...

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Please expand on this statement for those of us that are on the fence about attending the sardine event.

I sure hope it doesn't rain. There is no where near enough pave parking taking away the skid pad area too. And one foot off the pavement and you are stuck when it rains.

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Originally Posted by AllZWay

I sure hope it doesn't rain. There is no where near enough pave parking taking away the skid pad area too. And one foot off the pavement and you are stuck when it rains.

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You are right on that JP...if it does NOT rain there should be plenty of places to park trailers (outside the fence if necessary) and free up hardtop for parking cars, but if it rains....well, that's a totally different deal.

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Originally Posted by kbrewmr2

20-30 spaces don't work for 40-50 car grids.

Also that area is being turned into a useful tech area, as tech where it used to be doesn't work.

Any of the other groups don't get to park together. Not sure if that's because they don't really try or what though...

to boil it down into one word: progress!

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So now we need to behave like others that don't hang out together. Doesn't seem like progress to me.
Seems like NASA Texas is focused on TT and HPDE.

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Originally Posted by rleng1

So now we need to behave like others that don't hang out together. Doesn't seem like progress to me.
Seems like NASA Texas is focused on TT and HPDE.

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Shut up Randy...........you just had a heart attack. Remember?

JJ

That was 2 years ago. Feeling good.
Where did you hear that?

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Originally Posted by kbrewmr2

Any of the other groups don't get to park together. Not sure if that's because they don't really try or what though...

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TT used to park together; we had great times. Especially at MSRC - OMG. That reminds me of the time Mike Z laughed so hard he snorted Patron through his nose...damn painful way to do a shot
That was how I prepared for the legendary AI/CMC party nights...miss those ....

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Originally Posted by rpoz27

Please expand on this statement for those of us that are on the fence about attending the sardine event.

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nevermind, Dave confirmed TT would be the only one and only if the group size was 35+ (which is doable, I'm expecting to break our record of 43)
http://www.nasaforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=54895

as far as the focus, that's just a Dave question. I will say that you outta look at other regions before you cast that stone though. TX is the only one I've been around that crams DE1 & 2 together and crams DE4 and TT together just to make room in the day for 4-5 dedicated race groups. Everywhere else is reversed from that. Also, I haven't had the amount of races reduced or the length of the races in my group shortened yet. Have you guys?

The grid hasn't worked there every time I've been to Cresson these past few years. Change was overdue honestly. Especially now with one of the race groups being exceedingly too big for the existing area (SM & Lightning), along with the TT group being too big as well.

And my last rant - don't get too pissy with DEers & TTers, where do you think future racers come from?

Just trying to make a point to have a plan.
I love DEer's and TT'ers, that is where we get racers, and the TT class has cool and fast cars, and some great drivers. I'm sure other driving events have a large amount of cars at MSRC, so hopefully someone has some best practices from those events.

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Originally Posted by rleng1

I'm sure other driving events have a large amount of cars at MSRC, so hopefully someone has some best practices from those events.

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very good point - I don't get to run with groups besides NASA, so maybe if others have, and if the groups were big enough maybe they can throw out some other ideas that'd help us make our events even better :)

Thanks to whoever posted the map. That helps! We are trying to figure out the best plan. If it won't work, then we will revert to the normal even if it is a pain in the ass.

Thoughts....

1. Nothing is set in stone. Just one idea to try to make a more usable paddock and not have the cluster F that challenged the schedule last year. I wanted to give everyone a heads up and try to get some creative positive ideas.

2. No the facility wasn't designed for racing or for more than 150 cars. We can try to grow to capacity and stretch to accommodate. One option is to limit entries. 150 and that is it. I will form the groups based off that number at the time of entry. Once we hit maximum regardless of mix, we are closed. There are other bad side effects like $400 entry fees. Or we can skip Cresson all together if it is not meeting our needs.

3. We can probably fit some cars and paddock spots on the skid pad after we layout grid. But, AI/CMC as a whole will not be able to park there as one big group. But you might be held from going anywhere until cars leave grid. A skinny access road just doesn't allow for easy 2 way traffic.


4. As for sharing the space under the awning with tech, we need room for 15 cars to be impounded. If there is space left over see #3.

5. If it rains, all bets are off and it will be a complete nightmare with people paddocked on 377. No different regardless of where we put grid.

6. I still have about 6 different plans on my desk trying to figure out best options.

Any plan is better than no plan and "see what happens". The Rehagen boys brought a sheet of plywood to park each car on at nationals since they knew they'd be on the grass. Worked fine for them.

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Originally Posted by Al Fernandez

The Rehagen boys brought a sheet of plywood to park each car on at nationals since they knew they'd be on the grass. Worked fine for them.

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I'd have plenty of room for that if I had their trailer too...

...and their budget... :p

Plywood fits under your car as long as you drop it down before you load :)