I didnt delete it....

[GlennCMC70]

Glenn, this is the long version of Todd's statement at Rookie Day. This being said, for perspective racers getting into the series...I suggest you post this in the RULES verbatim, right under the 2010 change of the word "rules" to "Guidelines". Prevents a shit-ton of misunderstandings later and establishes that you better be prepared to be disappointed by the director's choices to enforce each rule differently for different people on different days.

This should not be different than info you should have known since day one w/ AI/CMC in Texas w/ Todd in charge. this is not new news. i've known this all along.

Personally, I'm still pissed about the "allowances" or "fix it tickets" and the reasoning Todd gave me a few weeks ago.

Lets not read to much into this statement, but just in case you have, i'll add to it. if we have a great candidate for AI/CMC in DE's or TT, we will allow that person to run w/ us even if the car isnt 100% legal (what if its only 50% legal? likely not). that doesnt mean we will let them run that way untill his first win (like the Mid Atlantic guys do btw), but rather he's given a pretty short timeframe to comply, but as long as he's a back marker, it shouldnt be a major deal. dont think for a minute that a backmarker that has a 100% legal car, that we will allow then to install a non-legal part and run w/ us. that will get a big "hell no".

Not dinging Lindsay's car for the notched frame rails on day 1 at a national event and nullifying the race results from an illegal car that was OBVIOUSLY at an advantage was the wrong call even if the arguement was that Pat bought it from flaherty that way or it had been run regionally in Kali that way too. Of all people who KNOW the rules, S&S/Pat should have known better. I would have been fine with nullifying the results from Thursday's race in a DQ, (yes, a win for me) then allowing him to weld in material and race the rest of the weekend is a no brainer. Not nipping it in the bud Day one allowed all the rest of the crap to get out of hand, including the start of Sunday's race as he would NOT have been on the front row. I'd probably pull the track record from him too....but hey, that's just me. The second "no call" that rubs me raw is Corey's pass under double yellow taking back the pass under yellow the viper then gave back. Yep, confusing but on video, called in by corner workers and very bad under the rules. We all learned that lesson in 2008 that there is ZERO passes under yellow...PERIOD. Consistancy? Where was it? So, yeah, I feel robbed by Todd/AL's regional managment used at a national event...I realize that is going to happen in racing, but it most certainly doesn't mean I have to like it.

sounds like to me the right call was made. a racer figured out a mistake and corrected it. you had an advantage taken away and feel cheated. if the senario was to where you ended up w/ an advantage, i bet you would never said a word. pretty petty to be so pissed over guys doing the right thing and correcting a mistake w/ no outside influance to do so.

TJ, you are correct. Knowing your fellow racers and working together to enforce rules is key. However, relying on racers to police the rules also results in possible shady deals between racers and fosters LARGE areas of gray that causes frustration. It also throws wrenches in place when racers have to destroy their good relationships with their fellow racers and put down protests because the race director won't enforce a rule.

and is that what you call a friendship? someone who is wiling to cheat to beat you? you dont file a protest to protect that type of friendship? i'll file a protest against a friend anyday of the week (and yes i have - Nick Runyon). I wouldnt get mad if you filed one on me, although you just talking to me would likely save you the hassle. racing on track is just racing. part of that racing is also protests filed in the pits. i can separate that stuff from my off track friendships i have. same as if paperwork was filed against me. yes, the directors role is to catch those issues before the racers do, but it just doesnt happen that way.

I'm sure if any of us had to start calling our fellow racers out on the table for tech because of suspicions, the "just for fun" factor would be out the window in a heartbeat.

If we had to, then likely so. but the great thing about this level of racing is we all try our best to bring a legal car to the track. i have faith in my fellow racers that they will bring a legal car to the track just as they have the same faith in me. i could be willing to cheat to pay my bills and feed my family, but never to i could brag to my friends about how bad i beat those guys last weekend. in the end, thats all we really walk away from at this level - bragging rights.

To answer Glenn's question about why I didn't file the protest on the sunday race for Corey taking his position back under double yellow, it was that Todd/AL already told me they made up their minds and I'd waste $100, and to push the situation would have soured my relationship with corey. I valued that relationship with my fellow racer more than protesting my way to 2nd place instead of 3rd. It's not my responsibility to make that call. It's the director's responsibility to enforce that rule. I discussed that with Todd and he wouldn't admit error. Fine. Again, I don't have to like it or support it either.

Sounds like Todd did you a favor he didnt have to do. he knew Cory did the right thing. in other forms of racing, they would have told you to fill it out and put up the money just to fund the beer kitty.
there have been several issues that i just didnt agree w/ in any way and no amount of talking was/is going to change my mind. but at the end of the day i dont take it personal and i'm still friends w/ those guys no different than i was before. its that "seeing other's point of view" that you accused me of in a different post. you dont have to agree w/ it, but it helps if you can understand/see it. once agian Matt, your not the only racer in this world who feels he got the short end of the stick. Todd has likely been on the recieving end of that more times that he cares to admitt.

As for letting "slower" guys run illegal cars....well, how does that make sense when we have inverted races twice a weekend? While it doesn't usually effect Toyo races, it does still affect season points battles.

and that is where i 100% totally disagree w/ you. take a look at all the points sheets from 2005 to 2009 and show me where one driver finished lower in season points than where thier talent indicates they should have finished due to inverted races? you aint gonna find it. Inverts are the best thing for Grassroots racing. it keeps points battle interesting to the end and allows novice drivers a chance to get up to speed quicker than otherwise would be possible. inverts are a win/win deal.

If they are always a backmarker and back there just having fun, why do they NEED illegal parts to continue to do so? I'd think helping them work harder with a legal car would better there skills and prop their ego rather than "they are letting me cheat so I don't look so slow".... :?: Hell, I'll donate my time to help them get there...legally and with better skills.

Do you think anyone here w/ us is OK w/ running non-legal parts? who does this now? you are not the only racer that would donate their time to do this. i see it all the time. in fact, this shows your not a 100% lost cause. there is hope for you yet. :wink:
we also dont give timelines based on talent level. if the racer says "i'll never be able to comply w/ the rules" for whatever reason, we will likely tell them, OK, sorry, but you will have to run somewhere else.

Al, your point of "just for fun" "racing".... I get it. However, I think the philosophy does more harm trying to fix issues to fix other issues in an attempt to manage chaos and overall, it pisses people off and the current situation instills fear for people to speak their minds....because when they do, they suffer my fate and get labeled as an asshole or dismissed by a director who is unwilling to admit fault. I think you aren't giving the racers in this region enough credit to be able to have fun off the track and still have a serious, viable "as close to pro-racing as possible" event. It is NASA PRO RACING.com right?

i seriously do not think there is anyone here afraid to speak their mind. Texas AI/CMC just isnt known for that. i am willing to listen, but i think you are not. you keep talking about "we this" and "us that". who is the "we" and "us"? i hear alot of folks telling me and Al different that what you are saying. it would be one thing if i didnt hear anything, but i hear the opposite.
if you feel like Matt, let me know. i'll not hold it against you.

I'd put $1000 on the table that the racers in this group would have just as much fun, IF NOT MORE, if we had strict enforcement. It's the racers, their families and their friendships that make this stuff fun. Not the "help" we get by being lax on the rules. The frustration, the "bad internet" assumptions and opinions would simply go away with strict enforcement. The racers who fear we don't enforce contact strictly enough would start coming back/to the series when they aren't afraid well known offenders would be dealt with accordingly. Trust me, the saturday night BBQ at ECR and Hallett wouldn't change ONE bit. Those that choose not to socialize with us can still choose to not participate, and those of us that like each other don't have to fear avoiding another racer who got DQ'd because we filed a protest.


Here is a GREAT scenario to validate my point. 2006, last event of the year. Marvel and I were fighting for the regional championship down to the last race. during qual, I passed chris under waving yellow in the rain. I admitted it...however, nothing was going to be done about it, my Pole position would have stood, and it would have come down to the results of the last two races to determine the champ. This forced Chris to file a protest, which REALLY pissed me off, but I suppose I would have done the same thing with what was on the line. It created a LOT of animosity toward Chris for a long time but I eventually got over it....but Wow, Regional champ in my rookie year was taken away by a protest that should have been enforced by a director...yes it was Clifton, not Todd but the point was it wasn't strictly enforced.

Instead of being mad at Chris, you should have been mad at yourself. You made the first mistake - the pass. Clifton cannot enforce what he doesnt see or have called into him. You could have given up the pole yourself. You shouldnt have been upset over Chris doing what he's allowed to do "BY THE LETTER OF THE RULE BOOK", a thing in which you want. a thing that will not (from your POV) not change anything w/ our group, but yet it did w/ you. Sounds like you want other to be the bad guy on your behalf because you dont have the sack to do it yourself. but in reality, there should be a bad guy at all. racing is racing, and friendship is friendship. my friendship is never dictated by what happens while racing.

Fast forward to James' mistake that would result in a non-droppable DQ. It would have cost him the regional championship. So, now we are up to "just for fun" racing again and the decision is overturned, albeit with a lot of input. I guarantee you SOMEONE felt pressured to keep their mouth shut and not protest...technically, they couldn't anyway as too much time had lapsed. In both scenarios, there is a considerable difference in Toyo bucks at the end of the season. so while the "fun" decision to make folks feel good at that moment felt good, it CERTAINLY did make a BIG change at the end of the season.

i feel pretty sure when i say the everyone affected by the issue w/ James was 100% OK w/ it. it was also more than just an issue of "he didnt mean to do it". it was a poorly written rule that allowed for interpretation. it was promptly re-written to be more clear w/ its intent (verified by NASA HQ). the intent was to never prevent the DQ from being droppable in that case.

At the end of the day, you guys are in charge, think you are right and the perception is that you don't care for our input or reasoning regardless. I'm happy that you finally put in print above in bold what has NEVER been said....sadly, it's too late for me and I'm just too soured by it after having dealt with it for 4 years. Had that philosophy been voiced loud and clear from the beginning, I and others probably would have been much happier.....probably most not having to hear/see us bitch about it.

All I can ask at this point is that you reconsider....because I can't afford "big boy" Koni Challenge racing...but that doesn't stop you from being the cheap, damn close alternative.

Maybe I'm just trying to use too much reason?

possibly you assume you speak on the behalf of everyone. as best i can tell, we loose very few racrs due to the reasons you say. in fact, each year we gain more than we have ever lost in total due to your reasons. so w/ that track record in place, we will likely keep doing things the way we think works best. its working in every NASA Region as best i can tell.